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Senate
9 July 1930

12^th Parliament · 1^st Session

QUESTION
- TARIFF
AUSTRALIA HOUSE
TARIFF: RETALIATORY ACTION BY OTHER COUNTRIES
- Formal Motion for Adjournment
- Height of Tariffs - Commercial Treaties
QUESTION
- COLONIAL SUGAR REFINING COMPANY’S PROFITS
PAPERS
COTTON INDUSTRIES BOUNTY BILL
ESTIMATES AND BUDGET PAPERS, 1930-31
BANKRUPTCY BILL
- Second Reading
WESTERN AUSTRALIAN AGREEMENT (WILUNA GOLD MINES) BILL
- Second Reading

The President (Senator the Hon. W. Kingsmill) took the chair at 3 p.m., and read prayers.

page 3803

QUESTION

TARIFF

Fine Woollen Fabrics

Senator COOPER:
QUEENSLAND

– Is it a fact that, owing to the present high rates of tariff; fine wool fabrics have risen in price to the extent of 19s. or 20s. a dress length? If so, will not such an increase have the effect of creating a greater demand for artificial. materials, which will react to the detriment of the Australian . wool, industry? Can the Minister, also. say. to what extent fine wool materials, woven three ounces to the square yard, are manufactured in Australia ?

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ALP

– I do not think’ that there is any doubt . ‘that the.’ tariff schedules have not had the results’ suggested by the honorable senator; but, in order -that I may obtain the information sought, ‘I ask thathe place his. question on the . notice-paper.

page 3803

AUSTRALIA HOUSE

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.Has the attention . of the Vice-President ofthe Executive Council been directed to a statement in ‘ to-day’s Sydney Morning Herald that Mr. P. Coleman, M.H.R., is’ investigating the administration of Australia House and . will spend at least one month investigating the various departments ? In view of the fact that the Minister for Trade and Customs has just returned from London, and that the right honorable the Prime Minister and two other Ministers will shortly be in London, does the Government think . that the expense involved in this investigation is justified?

SenatorDALY. - I suggest that the right honorable the Leader of the Opposition. (Senator Sir George Pearce) knows that the Minister. for Trade and Customs visited England in order -to attend the Naval Disarmament Conference; that he also knows- that the Minister -did excellent work there in the interests of.

Australia, and that his time was fully occupied with matters connected with tha conference. The right honorable gentleman also knows that the Prime Minister will pay the closest attention to the duties devolving upon him in connexion with the Imperial Conference, and will have no time to investigate the administration of Australia House. The time of the Minister for Markets and Transport (Mr. Parker Moloney) will be fully occupied in dealing with matters associated with the Economic Conference connected with the Imperial Conference. The Leader of the Opposition must be aware that after the Attorney-General (Mr. Brennan) has completed his work at Genova, his time also will be fully occupied at the Imperial Conference in London. From information that has been supplied to the Government, it is of the opinion that Mr. Coleman’s time can be profitably employed, even at some cost ro the nation,in attempting to effect economies which the Government suggests can be, and ought to be, effected in the administration of Australia House.

page 3804

TARIFF: RETALIATORY ACTION BY OTHER COUNTRIES

Formal Motion for Adjournment

The PRESIDENT (Senator the Hon W Kingsmill:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

– As I intimated on Friday, I have received from Senator Colebatch a letter informing me that it is his intention to move the adjournment of tho Senate for the purpose of discussing a matter of urgent public importance, namely, “ The consequence to Australia of retaliatory action by other countries that are penalized by recent tariff schedules, and more particularly the statement made recently by the Consul-General for Belgium, in its application to the frozen meat industry of Western Australia and the position of the pastoralists in the Kimberley districts of that State.”

Four honorable senators having risen in their places in support of tha motion.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH (Western Australia) [3.5]. - In accordance with the letter which I have forwarded to the President, I move -

That the Senate at its rising adjourn till 10 a.m. to -morrow.

My purpose in doing so is to direct the attention of honorable senators to a matter of great urgency, namely, the consequences to Australia of retaliatory action by other countries which are penalized by recent tariff schedules, and more particularly the statement made last week by the Consul-Gcncral for Belgium in its application to the frozen meat industry of Western Australia and the -position of the pastoralists in the Kimberley district of that’ State.

I take it that my first duty is to establish the urgency of this’ matter. Last week’s newspapers contained a statement from the Consul-General for Belgium, which I shall not read, although 1 propose to direct attention to one or two paragraphs in it. The Consul-General for Belgium pointed out that the purchases by Belgium from Australia last year amounted to over £9,000,000, while sales by Belgium to Australia during the same period represented a value of £910,000, leaving a trade balance of over £8,000,000 in our favour. He went on to enumerate the classes of goods purchased by Belgium from Australia, but the only one to which I intend to refer, as being pertinent to this motion, is frozen beef, valued at £438,000. The Consul-General also pointed out that all the commodities which Belgium purchased from Australia, with the single exception of butter, were imported into Belgium duty free. On the other hand, he stated that the new tariff schedules recently introduced ‘ into this Parliament’ practically meant that imports from Belgium are now almost barred. He said that very few of the articles affected can be listed as luxuries; that practically all of them are primary products for some secondary local industry, such as plate and window glass, glassware, velvet, piece goods, cotton linen and ticking, parchment paper, precious stones unset, chemicals, and machinery. The Consul-General went on to say that the public and the Government of Belgium are aware of the difficulties with which the Commonwealth is confronted, and wish Australia a prompt and complete recovery. He added that for the time being Belgium would not enforce any measure which would . hamper in any way the speedy reestablishment of complete prosperity; but that if tho prohibitory measures, and the elimination of fair competitive conditions of commercial intercourse, were given a permanent character, Belgium would feel fully justified in taking appropriate measures for directing the patronage of Belgian buyers to those countries where goods manufactured in Belgium are not excluded from the market by drastic customs dispositions. That is an extremely courteous statement. But it is so strong that we cannot afford to ignore it.

Shortly after that statement appeared in the press I received an urgent telegram from the Premier of Western Australia drawing ray attention to the fact that the imposition of a duty on frozen beef entering Belgium would mean the closing down of the Wyndham Freezing Works, with disastrous results to the whole of the cattle-raisers in the East Kimberley district. The measure of those results F shall indicate a little later.

Senator Daly:

– There is no danger of that now. The Consul-General for Belgium is quite satisfied.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.L’ do not think that any one is quite satisfied. I want first to refer to the position of our trade with five countries - four European countries and Japan - with which we have had trade connexions, none of which is at all satisfied with the present state of affairs. “ The following table reveals the exchange of business between Australia and the countries men,tioned taking the average for’ the past five or six years : -

We have purchased approximately £15,000,000 worth of goods per annum from those five countries, and . in return they have bought from us goods to the value of” £55,000,000, a trade balance iri our favour of approximately £40,000,000. We are told that this is all emergency legislation. No matter how acute our difficulties may be, what good are we going to effect for Australia by disturbing trade relations that are so tremendously to our advantage? Personally, I do not hesitate to say that this form of legislation cannot possibly be of any good in any emergency. I direct the attention of honorable senators opposite to a statement that was recently made by the British Chancellor of the Exchequer, Mr. Phillip Snowden, who uttered a warning against a rush to quack remedies which, he stated, only aggravated bad conditions. He was afraid that there was a good deal of that to-day. Those are very wise words. Mr. Snowden went on to say that he was sure that high tariffs, being such a hindrance to trade, were in some degree responsible for the depression of world trade. He added that the Government must bc as reasonably assured as possible that the schemes it sanctioned were sound, and would conform to the conditions that it had laid down as to the efficiency of industry and the low cost of production. Those are the two things that we are putting right out of our minds. We are adopting instead what Mr. Snowden describes as quack remedies. How is it to be supposed that those countries can continue making their purchases from us if we refuse to buy from them ? France has already imposed retaliatory duties on our wheat and butter. Germany has imposed duties on our products, but they cannot be termed retaliatory because they have also been extended to the products of other countries. Whereas in 1926-27, Germany, France and Italy purchased from us 33,000,000 bushels of wheat, representing 52 per cent, of our total export, last year Germany and France purchased none of our wheat and Italy only about 3 per cent, of our total export. That indicates that we are cramping our market. The Italian trade with Australia is of comparatively recent origin. It began in a comprehensive way in 1919, when Italy established a line of steamers to trade from Europe to this, country. . Since then Italy’s purchases from Australia have reached as high a figure as £10,000,000 in one year and haveaveraged £5,250,00.0 per annum. On the other hand her sales to us have been between £1,000,000 and £2,000,000 per annum, a great balance in our favour.. During the eight years from 1921-22 to- 1928-29, we have bought from Italy £10,500,000 worth of goods as against Italy’s purchases from Australia in that period of £49,000,000, a trade balance is* our favour of approximately £38,500,000. An Italian steamer calls at our ports about once a month, and during the last two years 22 have visited Australia and have payed in harbour and wharfage, other dues and wages, an average of £12,500 each, or a total of about £140,000 a year. Italy now contemplates putting on bigger steamers for our trade. They will be motor ships, and while they will need less coal, they will call for greater service in other directions. Similar remarks apply to the trading activities of France and Germany with Australia. Their ships come to our ports, give employment on our wharfs, in our coalmines and in many other directions. The biggest item that Italy takes from Australia, and this applies very much to Germany and France, is wool, of which Italy bought 120,00.0 bales last year. Of that total that country was under an obligation to buy only two-thirds of her requirements from Australia. Because of the quality of our wool, Italy could not, without injury to itself, refrain from buying less than 80,000 bales of wool from Australia, but it could- purchase the remaining 40,000 to. 50,000 bales from any other country as well- as it could from us. The same remarks apply to France and Germany.

Tallow is another’ commodity that Italy purchases largely from Australia. It also buys a good deal of our wheat, as well as copra from the islands, through Sydney. All of those products could be purchased just as well from other countries, and in all of those matters Italy could have retaliated without any injury to herself.

We want the very opposite set of conditions to apply. We want to see those countries buying more of our products. There is no reason why we should not build up a trade with them in our butter and meat. Only recently tenders were called for a contract to supply tinned meat to cover the army and navy requirements of. Italy. I have very good reason to believe that had we been on sound friendly trading relations with Italy, a part, at least, of that very considerable contract would have ‘ come our way. Two tenders were received from Australia, one from the Wyndham meat works and the other froma meat works in one of the eastern States.

The reason given why Australia was not favoured with the contract was that there was no shipping available. I venture to suggest that that is not altogether a sufficient reason, and that had Italy been treated as a good customer ought to be treated, a very good fight would have been put up for that tender, with a reason able hope of success.

Our next step was to prohibit the importation of lemons from Italy. Australia has not imported lemons from that country except when the product was not available in Australia.

SenatorRae. - That is not correct. I have seen thousands of cases coming in when we had plenty of our own in the

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.Usually we purchase Italian lemons only when our own are not available. I have a letter from the -New South Wales Wholesale Distributors Association setting out that point very clearly.. It states that there have been no importations of Italian lemons in recent years,- except in the summer months, when they are badly wanted and our own are practically unobtainable. I suggest that Australian consumers will discover between December and February next, when it will be difficult to purchase lemons, that an injury has been done- to them by excluding the Italian product.

One of the best known imports into Australia from Italy is the Borsalino hat. I wonder whether honorable senators realize what happens in regard to that hat, which sells in Sydney, Melbourne and other centres at 37s. 6d. The first stage is that the Italian manufacturer buys in London Australian rabbit skins for each hat, at a cost of 3s. to 4s. I understand that he manufactures the skins into a Borsalino hat and sells the finished article at11s. f.o.b. Genoa. From that l1s. it is necessary to deduct approximately 3s. 6d., the price of the skin, leaving 7s. 6d. as the total amount remaining for the Italian manufacturer.

Senator Hoare:

– What is wrong with the Australian-made hat?

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCHNothing, so far as I know. The Borsalino hat is delivered at Sydney at 15s. 6d. c.i.f., to which must be added. 8s. 6d. for duty, making a . total of 24s. It costs to distribute the article almost double as much as the manufacturer receives for making it. That is the condition of affairs that must always arise from excessive tariffs. They invariably lend themselves to monopolies of that description, involving the consumer in a much greater charge than is justified.

Japan sells to us approximately £4,000,000 to £5,000,000 worth of goods per annum and purchases in return commodities to the value of £12,500,000, an advantage in our favour of about £8,000,000. Among the’ articles sold to Australia is a comparatively small quantity of Japanese oak which pur furniture makers say is essential to enable them to carry on their business satisfactorily. Our importations of that item amount to about £150,000 per annum. Japanese oak has now been shut out, to our detriment, and to the great annoyance of the people who are our very good customers. I understand that already Japan’s purchases of our wool have fallen off in recent years.

Senator Guthrie:

– The -honorable senator is in error. The purchases of our wool by Japan have increased.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.That being so, the figures relating to our trade with Japan are even more striking. The fact that Japan is increasing its purchases from Australia, entitles that country to more consideration at the hands of this Government.

I come now to the case of Belgium. Our exports to that country last year totalled’ over £9,000,000 and the total value of our imports from Belgium was only £910,000. Under the provisions of the Belgian Tariff, it is competent for the Government of Belgium to impose certain import duties without reference to Parliament. There is a marked difference, apparently, between the practice in Belgium and the practice here. In some countries, including the United States of America, no tariff duties can be collected by the Government until Parliament has approved of the schedule; but in Great Britain a tariff becomes operative directly it is tabled in the House of Commons, although it is regarded as a strict obligation on the part of the Government that it shall give Parliament the earliest opportunity to consider the matter. In Belgium, and apparently also in some other countries, the Government has discretionary power, within certain closely defined limits, to impose tariffs; but in Australia, which is supposed to be the most democratic country in the world, we are living under a very complete despotism in this matter. It is competent for the Commonwealth Government to impose a tariff by simply laying a new schedule on the table. In this way a tariff may be imposed and duties collected under it for many months before Parliament has an opportunity to consider the Government’s proposals. This Government has done that. Eight months have elapsed since its first tariff schedule was laid on the table in another place, and I venture to say that a period of twelve months will elapse before the representatives of the people in this Parliament will have an opportunity to discuss it. This condition of affairs does not obtain in any other country. If the Government of Belgium exercised its power to impose a tariff on Australian frozen meat, as it threatened, it could, without consulting Parliament, levy a duty of between id. and i of Id. per lb., which would be sufficient to exclude the whole of our Wyndham frozen beef from the Belgium market.

Senator Daly:

– Will the honorable senator give me the reference to the legislation which he has mentioned? I understood’ the Government of Belgium proposed to levy 2-llth of Id. duty on Australian beef.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.The tariff on frozen beef is 30 francs per 100 kilograms, which the Belgian Government, without the consent of Parliament, could impose.

Senator Daly:

– That is about l-5th of Id. per lb. duty.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.With reference to our Wyndham frozen beef, I ask honorable senators to believe that I speak on this matter with a fairly exact knowledge, because for seven years I was a member of the Government in Western Australia. For the greater part of that time I was Minister controlling the Wyndham meat works, and, later, as Agent-General in London, I supervised the selling of its products. In connexion with this matter, I should like- to read to honorable senators the following tele* gram which I received from the Premier of Western Australia a few days ago: -

Exports Belgium last season £150,000 equals 07 per cent, total output. During last six years output to Belgium represents 83 pur cent. Loss of this market will inevitably close works as Germany already prohibited imports of frozen beef since 30th June. Result on pastoral industry Kimberleys disastrous as Wyndham only outlet, and in Northern Territory result serious. Wyndham lias been carried on for many years at heavy loss to maintain pastoral industry which will inevitably close down if Belgium prohibits imports. Contract for tinned beef for Royal Navy docs not improve position as could be carried out without interference Belgian trade.

The market for that class of beef is very limited, because the beef is regarded as second grade. By this I do not mean that it is inferior in quality, but it is lean meat from small cattle, and it is almost impossible to sell it satisfactorily on the Loudon market. If it -were placed there, the exporters would certainly have to take much lower prices, and it would be impossible for them to carry on the industry. Consequently, they are obliged to look to the continental market for their outlet. They have been, selling their meat in Belgium and other European countries, practically ever since the Wyndham meat works started. The construction of those works was begun in 1914, prior to the war. When war broke out the Government then in power, a Labour Government, found itself in serious . difficulties, and wisely or unwisely - I do not propose to debate that point now - it decided to complete the contract itself. As a result the works cost £880,000. Since then there has had to be added loss of interest amounting to £692,000, bringing the capital value of the works up to £1,572,000. Since 1919 up to the present time, with the exception of one1 year, the meat works have been carried on by the State. During the first three years, the losses were very heavy, but since then the loss has been equivalent to the charge for interest and amount to be set aside for the sinking fund. The Government realized that even if the works were closed, it would be losing just as much money, because interest and sinking fund charges would still have to be met, so in the interests of the cattle-growers of East Kimberley, who depend upon the works as an outlet for their stock, it determined to keep the works open. The industry provides employment for a considerable number of men, who receive good wages. I do not suggest that the men do not earn them. I have visited the works on many occasions and I can say without fear of contradiction that no mull work better than do the employees of the Wyndham meat works. As I have said, the establishment is of advantage to the community generally, and particularly to the cattle-raisers, who, if the works were closed, would have no outlet for their stock, and consequently could not carry on. There has been a small loss in addition to the interest and sinking fund charges in the operation, of the works during the last seven years. If now the Belgian meat market is closed to us the loss to the exporters will not be less than id., per. lb., and it will amount to £25,000 a year; If the works are closed the effect upon settlement in that part of Australia- will be disastrous. It is true that Vestys and Bovril Estates Limited have large interests in the Northern Territory. One of the firms mentioned has important interests in the Argentine, and the other in the United States of America, so I have no doubt that they will be able tq carry on. But what will become of the hundreds of small growers of cattle who depend, upon the Wyndham meat, works for the sale of their stock.

Senator Guthrie:

– Vesty’s works at Darwin have been closed for years.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

– 1 was referring particularly to Vesty Brothers’ interests in cattle stations. 1 understand they have about sixteen properties, and, if I remember right, nine are in the Northern Territory, and seven in Western Australia. A fair number of cattle from those stations is sent to the Wyndham -works. Bovril Estates Limited also have’ large properties in North Australia, and they, too, send some of their cattle to Wyndham. These two big firms have huge interests in other parts of the world,’ and they could carry on even if the Wyndham meat works were closed down. In fact, I think it likely that, between them, they would absorb the bulk of tlie small cattle-owners who would be forced to go out of business. There is no more stirring epic in the colonizing history of Australia than the’ wonderful achievement of the Duracks, who, in 1S83, sot out from Queensland with 8,000 head of cattle, on a trek lasting two years and eight months. They lost five members of their party and one-half of their stock before they established the cattle-raising industry in the East Kimberleys. These people and their descendants have stuck to the job ever since, and it is deplorable to think that they are now in danger of being driven from their holdings if the Wyndham meat works are forced to close. The cattle industry of the Kimberleys has decreased considerably during the last niue or ten years. There has been a falling off of from 640,000 head in 1916 to 564,000 head in 1927. The East Kimberley portion of 1 lie north-west is served by the Wyndham Moat Works; but most of the West Kimberley cattle go down to the Perth market, which cannot be reached by those in .the East Kimberley. Notwithstanding the general decrease in the Kimberleys as a whole, the number of cattle in the East Kimberley district has increased in the period named by 56,000.

Senator Guthrie:

– How many beasts are slaughtered at Wyndham?

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH,From 25,000 to 30,000 a year.

Senator Sir William Glasgow:

– Practically all of the meat is exported.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.Yes; at times a small quantity has been despatched to the local market. I think honorable senators will realize that it is practically impossible to sell frozen beef in competition with, fresh beef, and that only in exceptional circumstances will it be possible to sell frozen beef if our present market is closed to us. According to the statement of the Premier of Western Australia, which I have quoted, and that made to me by the general manager of the Wyndham Meat Works, who has been in his present position since the works were established, if the Belgian market, which has been taking practically SO per cent, of the works’ output, is closed, the works will have to be- shut down, and the people in that district will be left without any possible outlet for their cattle. The time allotted for the discussion of this motion does not permit me to touch upon many of the phases of this question that I should like to discuss. We cannot, however, ignore the possibility that France, Germany, Belgium, and Italy may, under present circumstances, combine to totally shut out Australian products. It will then be found that our difficulties are more serious than they are to-day. It has been said in another place that France has no right to discriminate against Australia, because in imposing u general tariff we are not discriminating against France. People give their own interpretation ‘to words. It is all very well for us to say that the Commonwealth does not discriminate between States in the payment of bounties to those producing a certain commodity iri a particular State, but it is doing so. Foreign countries will naturally say that in imposing a tax on particular goods which they produce we are discriminating against them. If it is considered by other countries that we are discriminating against them they will naturally discriminate against us. . If they choose to place a certain interpretation on our action we cannot contest their opinion. In submitting this motion to the Senate, I will mention one point which I have not time to discuss at length : We all hope the League of Nations is going to make for peace. The Government appears to have almost childlike faith in the League; but there will never be anything approaching enduring peace and real prosperity amongst the peoples of the world unless we mete out to each other international justice, cultivate international friendship, and encourage international trade relations. Without these things there can be no world peace or world prosperity.

Senator DALY:
South AustraliaVicePresident of the Executive Council · ALP

– I entirely agree with the sentiments expressed in the concluding words of the mover of the motion. It has been the policy of this Government ever since it has been in power to encourage the. very best relations between Australia and the British dominions, and also between Australia and other nations. In view of the recent conference between the Prime

Minister (Mr. Scullin) and the Belgian Consul, the urgency for this motion disappears. There is no danger that the Wyndham Meat Works will be closed down in consequence of any action taken by the Government. I have been instructed to say that the conference between the Belgian Consul and the Prime Minister was of a most friendly character, and that, before the conference ended, there was a complete appreciation of the fact that the Government has been forced into its present position, and is prepared to modify its tariff when circumstances enable it to do so. We have had many discussions in the Senate concerning our adverse trade balance, which is largely the cause of the present depression, and I hope at some period during to-day’s sitting to submit for the consideration of honorable senators the Estimates and budget-papers for the financial year 1930-31, which will enable honorable senators to realize the very difficult position in which the Government is placed. There seems to be some doubt in the mind of Senator Colebatch as to the course which the Government is pursuing. Some honorable members suggest that we have adopted some foolhardy policy regardless of our economic position; but that impression would, I submit, be removed if honorable senators read the last annual report and balancesheet of the Commonwealth Bank, a paragraph of which reads -

Arising out of what has already been said in this report, there emerges a position which must be faced at once and met without any evasion - this refers to overseas importations into Australia. As it stands to-day as indicated, the position is already one of embarrassment in regard to meeting external payments, and there are no justifiable expedients which can be adopted to meet the situation, excepting the determination to drastically reduce the importations of things non-essential until such time as we are again in a position to pay for these from oversea surpluses the result of production. If, therefore, the adoption of this course has the effect which it must have, of drastically reducing our custom to peoples overseas, it must not be interpreted as any policy against international trading, but should be accepted by those concerned as an indication of our determination to meet the position in the only way that can be approved by those who believe in sound financial and commercial principles.

I submit that that clearly sets out the reasons why the Government has acted in. this way. Our position has been appreciated by other nations, and in the spirit which animated that particular passage’ in the report which I have just read. The report continues -

Whilst the import and export figures for the current financial year cannot be ascertained until after 30th June, those so far available indicate a serious position of drift in the direction of adverse balance.

– I understand that.

Senator DALY:

– In view of the early discussion on the budget, to discuss this matter fully now would simply be to duplicate that discussion. I have given Senator Colebatch an assurance that the Government is alive to the situation, so far as Belgium is concerned. I have also informed him that a conference between the Consul-General for Belgium and the Prime Minister ended satisfactorily. In view of these facts, and the additional fact that at the Imperial Conference, which is to be held within a few weeks, the whole matter of our export trade will be discussed, I suggest that Senator Colebatch should withdraw his motion.

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE (Western Australia) [3.54]. - I do not propose to debate this motion at length; but I feel that the Senate is indebted to Senator Colebatch for having raised the question with which it deals. I am afraid that it is a matter which the Government has overlooked in its efforts to remedy the adverse trade balance. Every one sympathizes with the Government’s desire to rectify our adverse trade balance, which has been brought about, first, by Australia’s prosperity and the consequent tremendous purchasing power of her people, resulting in a very large flow of imports into this country; and, secondly, by the great drop in the value of our exportable produce. Several remedies might have been applied to the rectification of our adverse trade balance. The most natural of all remedies, and the one most in accord with economic facts, is an alteration of the rate of exchange. The second remedy is by increasing the tariff imposts. In my opinion, the Government rushed ahead in its use of the tariff without having fully examined all aspects of the question, of which the subject before us is one. If by shutting out imports, or by so raising the duties on imported goods as to effect a considerable reduction of imports, we lead other countries to take retaliatory action against our primary products, we shall be worse off than when we started, because we shall intensify our unemployment problem. In the past Germany has been an excellent customer for Australian fruit. The fruit industry in Western Australia has benefited considerably by reason of Germany’s purchases having prevented a glut on the English fresh fruit market. The prevention of that glut has enabled more satisfactory prices to be obtained than would otherwise have been the case. I understand that Germany is now about to impose retaliatory duties on goods imported from Australia. The same thing is true with regard to Australian butter imported into France. To show that the Government did not give full consideration to the economic effect of the imposition of these duties and prohibitions, alleged to have been designed to deal with the adverse trade balance, a former Minister for Trade and Customs (Mr. Gullett) checked the value of the imports represented by a number of the items in the list of prohibitions. He found that the value represented by twenty-two items now prohibited was only £300,000 last year. Obviously, our serious adverse trade balance could not be rectified by prohibiting those items, seeing that such a comparatively’ small sum is affected.

Senator Rae:

– The ocean is made up of numbers of drops of water.

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.If we must seek the restoration of the trade balance by imposing prohibitory duties, we should do so in respect of items of considerable value. Three hundred thousand pounds spread over 22 items, when compared with the adverse trade balance, is like a mud puddle compared with the boundless ocean. Yet it is in connexion with such comparatively insignificant items that friction is frequently created.

Had this question been examined by the Tariff Board, that body might have shown the effect of the imposition of these duties. I suggest that an examination by the Tariff Board would probably have shown the danger of retaliatory action being taken by other countries. Senator Colebatch has shown that the Western Australian frozen beef industry cannot be considered exactly on all fours with the other meat exports of the Commonwealth, because the Western Australian product is peculiarly suited to the particular market in which it finds a sale. By singling out one country for special treatment of this kind, Ave really provoke the idea of retaliatory measures. This discussion will not have been in vain if it convinces the Government that in its desire to take immediate action to put the finances of the Commonwealth on a satisfactory footing, it imposed duties without fully considering their effect. I suggest that the Government would do well to review the tariff in the light of the question raised here to-day, and of other questions raised from time to time. Without waiting for a revision of the tariff by Parliament, the Government itself should revise it as soon as possible. At present the Government is master of the situation. Parliament is impotent, for it cannot even discuss the duties. If they remain in force for twelve months, much damage might result. I hope that the Government will not romain idle and allow the duties to remain in force, regardless of the consequences. This motion should show the Government that its action is already having ‘disastrous results. I hope that it will take immediate action to provide a remedy.

Senator GUTHRIE:
Victoria

– The Senate is indebted to Senator Cole batch for having brought this matter forward. Seeing that the balance of trade with the five countries which have been mentioned during this debate amounts to £40,000,000 per annum in our favour it would indeed be serious if any action taken by Australia led to retaliatory .steps which would prejudice that favorable trade balance. I agree with much thai Senator Colebatch has said, but I was not impressed by his plea on behalf of the Wyndham meat works in Western Australia. Those meat works are overcapitalized. Iti reply to an interjection. Senator Colebatch said that between 25,000 and 30,000 beasts were slaughtered annually at the Wyndham mea; works. The export figures for Western Australia show that the total export of beef represents a value of only £112,000 per annum - an average of about £3 10s. a beast. I am aware that Vestys spent about £2.000,000 in establishing a meat works at Darwin, which has now closed down owing to the refusal of the men to work. I do not think that Senator Colebatch improved his case by his reference to Bovril Estate Limited and Vestys, because those two huge concerns, according to him, own too great an area of the land in North-western Australia.

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

– That is not so.

Senator GUTHRIE:

– They own ten or twelve enormous stations in that district. It is a pity that they do. If that country is suitable for the production of high class beef, as I believe it is, it would be better if it were divided into smaller though of course not small holdings.

Height of Tariffs - Commercial Treaties

The main object of the work of the committee has naturally been the question of customs tariff levels which is closely bound up with that of commercial treaties.

The essential conclusion which emerges from the discussion in this field is that the Conference declares that “ the time has come to put an end to the increase in tariffs and to move in the opposite direction “. To achieve this result, it is recommended that action should be pursued along the three following lines: - Firstly, individual action by the various States with regard to their own tariffs; secondly, bilateral action through the conclusion of suitable commercial treaties; thirdly, collective action, by means of an inquiry undertaken by the economic organization of the League of Nations, with a view to encouraging the extension of international trade on an equitable basis by removing or lowering the barriers to international exchange set up by excessive customs tariffs.

I particularly direct the attention of honorable senators to the recommendation that bilateral action be taken through the conclusion of suitable commercial treaties.

SenatorRae. - Who elected that conference?

Senator CHAPMAN:

– It was a con- ference of delegates from practically all countries convened at the instigation of the League of Nations. The League of Nations took action following on the presentation of that report, and in April, 1928, the Economic Committee of the League in compliance with a particularly explicit recommendation of the conference, undertook to codify the most favoured nation treatment which it was pointed out should bc either the central principle or the normal outcome of every commercial negotiation. The report stated -

Within a few months the committee will be ready to furnish particulars which might serve as a basis for international engagements with regard to its mechanism, its scope, and iu bearing on multilateral conventions. The committee has also included in its programme the examination of those general, special, and geographical exceptions of which the introduction seemed desirable on account of established international practice or the peculiar circumstances of certain States.

The report of the Economic Committee on the work of its 25th session also continued the following statement by Dr. von Schubert : -

Guided by the resolution of the International Economic Conference, the committee concerned itself chiefly with the improvement of the treaty-making methods at present in use, which the conference recognized to be defective. Its main efforts were directed towards the unconditional application, on as liberal a scale as possible, of most favoured nation treatment which forms the best safeguard for the equitable treatment of commerce, and towards lbc lowering, by collective action, of customs duties regarded as excessive.

Not much was done by the League to induce collective action to bring about a lowering of customs duties, but much has been done by way of treaties. In July, 1927, the late Dr. Stresemann, speaking with reference to the. work of the International Economic Conference, said -

The conference declares that the time has come to put an end to the increase in tariffs a nd to move in the opposite direction.

These are momentous words, involving as t hey do, a whole programme of work which can only advance by progressive steps towards realization. The means to this end lie, first nf all, in the simplification and unification of the mechan ism of tariffs, in striving for greater stability in customs duties, in the introduction of improved methods of treatymaking, and, finally, in a gradual reduction of tariff burdens.

Three rouds lead, towards this goal: individual action by States with regard to tariffs; bilateral action through the conclusion of suitable commercial treaties, and, lastly, international concerted action. The importance of international co-operation in this field is strongly underlined by the conference and it is just this part of the work which falls within the province of the League of Nations and its economic organs.

The League found it difficult to secure united action. Accordingly, it directed its attention to the possibility of achieving the end desired by contractual methods. Dr. von Schubert; reporting on the work af the Economic Committee during its 24th session, stated -

The committee’s efforts are chiefly directed to placing contractual methods, including the most-favoured-nation clause, on a sound basis, and towards the possibility nf collective action with a view to the concerted lowering of customs barriers . . .

The council will remember the warm reception given to the recommendations of the Economic Conference both by the Assembly and by almost all the governments. The committee’s report states that various governments have taken practical steps to give effect to these recommendations, and further notes the influence the recommendations have had on the independent action of governments in their commercial policy, and instances the conclusion of numerous commercial treaties which have not merely lowered duties between the contracting parties, but, by the operation of the most-favcurcd-nation clause, have extended’ the benefit of the reductions to other countries also. To quote the report, “ It is no exaggeration to say that 1927 has been the year of commercial treaties.”

Senator Daly:

– That is not the position with respect to Belgium.

Senator Sir WILLIAM GLASGOW:

– It is in connexion with the product I am discussing, as I shall show the Minister. I was pleased to hear the Minister say that the embargoes which are at present imposed will either be removed or modified when our trade position justifies it. That . is the first ministerial statement we have had to that effect. Senator Colebatch has dealt with this subject from the view-point of Western Australia. It is also of vital importance to Queensland, which is the principal beef-exporting State, that the producers of frozen beef should be able to get a market for their surplus production, the export of which should be encouraged. . The beef produced in the northern part of Queensland is similar to that produced in the Wyndham dis trict. As the Darwin meat works are now closed, a large proportion of the cattle reared on the eastern side of the Barkly Tableland are marketed in Queensland, where they are slaughtered, frozen, and shipped. Certain circumstances have had a depressing effect upon the beef market since the beginning of the year and have resulted in stock dropping in price by over £2 a head. To-day the price of cattle at the Townsville meat works is 20s. per 100 lb., which is equivalent to a reduction of £2 a head on the price received at the end of last season. In 1921, 1922 and 1923 the price of cattle was below the cost of production; but since then the market has gradually improved, and during the last two years, in consequence of the reduced number of cattle in the country and of the improved condition of the market in Great Britain and on the continent, payable prices have been realized. The Belgian and German markets are important to Australian meat producers, because they absorb a large proportion of our second-grade beef, which, although of a lower standard, is good meat. This lean beef is suitable for continental markets.

Senator Daly:

– It is better than horse flesh.

Senator Sir WILLIAM GLASGOW:

– It is quite wholesome and excellent beef and I am rather surprised that the honorable senator should compare it with horse flesh. The continental markets take the lower-grade beef; they do not want fat beef; and the first-grade beef is absorbed by the English market. If the continental markets were not available for the lean beef, and it had to be marketed in Loudon, the only other place available, the effect would be to depreciate the market for our firstgrade beef. Senator Daly said that the Government’s action in connexion with these embargoes was not in the direction of discriminating against any European countries, but when a tariff is increased or an embargo is placed upon goods in the production of which certain countries specialize, it certainly has the appearance of discriminating against those countries. At any rate, that is the effect the embargo or the increased tariff is likely to have upon the people in those countries, just as we should regard it as discriminating agaiust Australia, if Belgium and Germany increased their tariffs on the second-grade beef we send to them. I hope that the Government when placing embargoes or increasing the duties upon commodities produced in foreign countries will have some regard for the effect its action is likely to have on some of our primary products. Beef gets no Government assistance in Australia, and every effort should be made to remove any hindrances there may be to getting’ it on to the best market. I hope that as soon as possible the Government will remove the embargoes or partial embargoes which have had the effect of offending certain of our excellent customers on the continent of Europe and elsewhere, and thus enable Australian products to get on the markets of those countries.

SenatorRAE (New South Wales) [4.55]. - I am not one of those who can on this occasion see their way to congratulate Senator Colebatch on bringing forward this motion, for the simple reason that it appears to me that it has brought about a position in which every honorable senator opposite, whetherhe approves of a high tariff, or admits one may be necessary in order to permit Australia to meet its adverse trade balance, wants something to be exempted. If all the wishes of honorable senators were fulfilled there would be no tariff at all. One wants Borsalino hats admitted free from Italy and another 3-oz. woollen goods from Belgium and so forth right down the list even to Japanese oak. Every honorable senator has some favourite commodity he wishes to be imported free of duty or nearly so. The whole tariff would be broken down if the Government acceded to all demands. I should be exceedingly glad if there were freetrade between every country. It would be an ideal condition of things, but retaliation is the very essence of tariffs. There is no fundamental principle involved in tariff legislation; excluding the use of customs duties for purely revenue purposes, it is almost entirely a matter of retaliation. Honorable senators opposite are apparently afraid that the result of the Commonwealth tariff will he that Japan will refuse to buy our wool and wheat, Germany will turn down our apples, France will not buy our butter and Belgium will not buy our meat. And it may be possible that Australians themselves, tens of thousands of whom are at present out of work and half-starved, will be compelled to eat the commodities they produce and wear woollen goods made by themselves from wool Australia produces. Such a calamitous state of affairs would break the hearts of our freetrade friends opposite! It is shocking that some honorable senators opposite seem to be filled with the idea that the only way in which a country can progress is to send away everything it produces of first-class quality and live itself on food of second-class quality. As I listened to Senator Chapman reciting the fact that certain nations in Europe are considering reciprocal tariffs and trade agreements it occurred to me that most of the European nations produce the same primary commodities.

Senator Chapman:

Senator CARROLL (Western Aus moments when the spirit of piety possessed the soul of Scotland’s national poet, he prayed -

O wad some power the giftie gie us,

To see oursels as others sec us!

Every day I read complaints emanating from nations that are good customers of ours, regarding our tariff increases, which are prejudicing their commercial relations with us. In the Melbourne Herald of the 2nd of this month there appears a statement on the matter, reading -

Following the Federal Government’s policy of .prohibiting the importation of luxuries, Mr. Forde, as Acting-Minister for Customs, refused permission for the importation of a consignment of French perfume valued at £3,000.

Members of the French Chamber of Commerce in Australia consider that, as regards customs duties, Australia has selected France for unfair discrimination.

A resolution passed by the chamber refers to “the absolute lack of consideration shown toward the country which, after Great Britain, is Australia’s best customer.” It is pointed out that for the last five statistical years the trade balance is in Australia’s favour to the extent of £66.000,000. Figures for 1928-29 show that imports amounted to £3,700,303 and exports to £15,141,155. The introduction of a prohibitive duty on Australian ‘butter is one stop that France has taken in an endeavour to remedy the position.

Another statement was made by M. Lestocquoy, the Assistant Trade Commissioner for France, who, speaking for the French Chamber of Commerce, said -

Although reluctant to criticize Australia’s internal policy members could not but resent the fact that in its classification of so-called luxuries, some of which were exclusively of French origin, the Federal Government had discriminated against the importation of certain classes of French goods.

The Federal Government, while totally prohibiting the importation of a few thousand pounds of French preserved fruits, soaps and furs, had omitted from the list of prohibition and even from any increase in duty unassembled motor-car chassis (imports value £7,712,723), petrol (£0,810,287), lubricating oils (£1,319,081) and cinema films (£1,500,000).

I think that the complaint with regard to petrol is likely to be removed to-day. M. Lestocquoy continues -

In view of the fact that France is one of the largest purchasers of Australian wool, the Chamber protests against such discrimination. It asks that preferential treatment be granted to certain goods that cannot be called necessities, and in so doing appeals to the sense of justice of the Federal Government. The French duty on butter is a retaliatory measure.

Senator HOARE:
South Australia

– I was astonished at the remarks of Senator Colebatch. The honorable senator adopted a very sympathetic attitude towards the Government of Belgium which has protested against the action of this Government in taking steps to correct Australia’s overseas trade balance. It seems to me that some honorable senators are protectionists when it suits them and when it does not suit them they declare for freetrade. Protection is the settled policy of Australia. I hope it will be endorsed by the people for all time. Since we stand for protection, surely it is unreasonable to expect the Government to alter its policy at the dictation of a government of another country which may be affected by increases in the Australian tariff. If we lower the tariff against Belgium, other countries which have trade relations with Australia will expect the same treatment. Senator H. E. Elliott reminded us that during the war Belgium was on the side of the Allies.

Senator Rae:

– What about the assistance which the Allies gave to Belgium?

Senator HOARE:

– No one can deny that Belgium received great assistance from the Allies during and after the war. If we acquiesced in the request of the Governments of all those countries that fought on the side of the Allies, and lowered our tariff barriers Australia eventually would become a freetrade country, and it would be impossible to establish new or extend existing industries in the Commonwealth. If all countries adopted a uniform wage scale and observed our standard of living, we might then be able to surrender our protectionist policy ; but so long as we observe a higher standard of living and pay our operatives in industry higher rates of wages than obtain in other countries, we must protect Australian industries and Australian workmen by customs duties. It would be unreasonable to expect Australian industries to compete on even terms with industries in other countries where the wage-rate is, in some cases, as low as lOd. a day. I am surprised at the attitude of Senator Chapman, who is a free trader and a protectionist by turns. I assisted the honorable senator to have a duty imposed on New Zealand butter, because I am a wholehearted protectionist, and T considered that all industries should be equally safeguarded. Senator Glasgow also reverses his policy when it suits him. The . honorable senator comes from Queensland, which State is interested in the export of beef to Belgium or other countries. For this reason he supported Senator Colebatch in his protest against any action by this Government which might jeopardize or endanger that trade. Because he is interested in the exportation of beef he is inclined to adopt the role of the freetrader, and, I assume, would have no objection to the introduction of Belgian manufactured goods at lower rates of duty. Possibly, even he would not oppose the importation of cotton goods from Belgium, although a week or two ago he supported the Government’s proposal to pay a bounty to cotton-growers in Queensland. To say the least he is inconsistent in his fiscal faith. Let us be honest about this matter. I fail to see how we can support any movement to interfere with this Government’s policy. Recently we passed a measure under which bounties to the amount of £800,000 will be paid to encourage the establishment of cottongrowing and its allied secondary industries in Australia. We, therefore, cannot consistently lower duties against imports of cotton and other goods which would threaten the destruction of our new industries. I cannot follow the Une of reasoning adopted by those honorable senators who are supporting the motion. Because Japan, for example, imports Australian commodities to the value of £9,000,000 a year, that is no reason why we should allow Japanese manufactured goods to compete on unfair terms with the products of Austra-. lian secondary industries.

France, Belgium, Italy, Japan and other countries purchase Australian products because they are either cheaper or better than can be obtained elsewhere. There is no sentiment in commercial transactions. Senator H. E. Elliott stated that owing to the shrinkage in our import trade there will be fewer vessels coming to Australia to lift our surplus primary products. That is a difficulty which every protectionist country has to face. No one denies that we must find an outlet for our surplus production in other countries. I agree that in return Ave must expect to receive from those countries goods of equal value, but not a fraction more, if we are to build up secondary industries in Australia. I contend that we cannot differentiate in our tariff policy. This Government has decided that curtain duties shall be imposed in the interests of the nation and we must stand by its decision. I am in sympathy with the cattle-growers in Western Australia who depend upon the Wyndham meat works for their outlet, and I should be exceedingly sorry if anything happened to make the closing of those meat works necessary. I am not satisfied that our tariff policy has injured Belgian trade to the extent mentioned. If Belgium wants our meat, and if it is cheaper or better than that country can obtain in other countries, it will continue to take the Australian product. I hope it will at all events.

Senator Carroll:

– I hope so, too.

Senator HOARE:

– Quite so. We must, however, remember that the adoption of a protectionist policy must, to some extent, affect other nations. I hope that some way will be found to assist the meat export industry of Australia, If we were to meet the wishes of Belgium in this matter we should be confronted with requests by other nations. We must face the position as we find it to-day. If the wool producers, for instance, are in an unsatisfactory position, the services of scientists must be utilized to assist them to produce a finer wool that will favorably compete with artificial silk, which is at present seriously affecting the woollen industry of Australia.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH (Western Australia) [5.53.]. - I do not feel that there is any necessity for me to apologize for having raised this question. It seems to me that it was high time that the Senate had an opportunity to discuss at least one feature of the Government’s fiscal policy. I do not disguise my own resentment of the fact that for eight months exorbitant customs duties have been imposed and collected without Parliament being in any way consulted. While I welcome the assurance of the Minister (Senator Daly) that these very high duties and prohibitions have been imposed only because of the present emergency, the satisfaction that I obtained from that statement was destroyed by the utterances of other honorable senators who supported the Minister. They assured us that these duties were in fulfilment of

Labour’s policy and that it is the desire of the Government nnder its protective policy to give the fullest possible protection to Australian industries, even to the point of prohibition. I am now wondering which is the correct statement. I accept that of the Minister because he speaks with a sense of responsibility. I believe that the Government has adopted this course only in this emergency, and therefore I must ignore the statements of other honorable senators opposite that this course has been followed- in pursuance of the policy of the Labour party.

SenatorRae. - We did not say that the emergency tariff was to remain in operation.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

– The embargoes and prohibitions?

Senator Rae:

– Yes.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

– I. am not prepared to admit that these prohibitions are necessary in the interests of Australia, and I assert without fear of truthful contradiction that the great volume of expert financial and economic opinion in Australia is entirely hostile to such a course. The Minister has directed attention to the last report of the Directors of the Commonwealth Bank. The words to which he directed particular attention were these - . . drastically reduce the importations of things non-essential, until such time us we are again in a position to pay for these from overseas surpluses the result of production.

But the importation of the chief nonessentials has not been drastically reduced. In fact, no serious attempt has been made to reduce importations in this respect. Senator E. B. Johnston referred to such articles as motor chassis, picture films, and things of that kind in connexion with which there has been no attempt to reduce importations, the prohibition of which would not have had such a serious effect upon Australia as the prohibition of a number of other essential commodities such as agricultural machinery has had. It is the first time that I have had an opportunity to peruse the report of the directors of the Commonwealth Bank, and when I endeavoured to obtain a copy, I was told that it was the only one available. I suggest that all honorable sena tors should be furnished with a copy of the report.

Senator Daly:

– Hear, hear! The honorable senator should have received a copy.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH.This one is rather out of date; but I suppose another report will be available shortly. We were informed by two or three honorable senators that the countries to which reference has been made did business with us only because they could obtain better goods or secure them at a lower price in Australia than elsewhere. But the fact of the matter is that our goods are as cheap and of a quality equal to similar goods of other countries. That is all. Competition is extremely keen. The3½ years’ experience I had as AgentGeneral for Western Australia in London, showed me how difficult it is to secure and retain markets. Most of the countries mentioned trade with Australia because we trade with them. It is not because our goods are better ; they are only as good and as cheap as similar goods of other countries. When other nations have, to choose between two countries offering articles of the same quality and at the same price, they naturally trade with the country which does business with them. They do not do it for sentimental reasons, but because the shipping freights and exchange rates are more favorable. It is not a question of whether one is a freetrader or a protectionist. It is the duty of honorable senators to bring before the Government the dangers of imposing excessive customs duties against good customers. Attention having been drawn to this matter the Government now says that it recognizes the position and intends to modify its policy when the time is opportune. The high protective policy which has been adopted by Australia for many years has not given very brilliant, results. I do not think it can be contended that our policy of protection has brought Australia to a state of prosperity, or that an extension of such a policy is likely to get us out of - our troubles. I am more inclined to accept the views of responsible economists in this country who say that our policy of protection and the payment of bounties must be reasonable, formulated with the idea of helping those industries suited to the country, and which do not suffer a maximum disadvantage as against other countries. The Government should not impose exorbitant customs duties or absolute prohibition without considering the effect that such a policy will have on other industries. That is my attitude. It is entirely reasonable and not inconsistent either with the policy of assisting Australian industries or giving reasonable preference to the Mother Country. 1 do not propose to detain the Senate in discussing this subject further. I repeat and emphasize that the views I have expressed are not only my own, but those of thousands of people throughout the country who believe that by imposing high customs duties, and prohibiting certain imports without reference to Parliament, the Government has abused the confidence of the people of Australia.

Senator Daly:

– I would not say that the Government has abused the confidence of the people.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

– The Senate having been given an opportunity by this means to express its opinion on this important subject, I ask leave to withdraw the motion.

Motion, by leave, withdrawn.

page 3828

QUESTION

COLONIAL SUGAR REFINING COMPANY’S PROFITS

Senator E B JOHNSTON:

asked the Minister representing the Minister for Trade and Customs, upon notice -

Is it a fact that the Colonial Sugar Refining Company, in its balance-sheet for the half-year ended the 31st March. 1930, departed from its customary practice of publishing separately the profits made in Australia and the profits made in New Zealand and Fiji?
Can the Minister inform., the Senate of the amount of profit made by the company in (a) Australia and (b) New Zealand and Fiji, for the twelve months ended the 31st March, 1930?

Senator DALY:
ALP

– The information is being obtained as far as possible.

page 3828

PAPERS

The following papers were presented : -

Audit Act - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1930, No. 74.

Commonwealth Bank Act - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1930, No. 72 -No. 73.

Lands Acquisition Act - Land acquired at Forrest, Western Australia - For Defence purposes.

Navigation Act - Regulations amended - Statutory Rules 1930, No. 59.

Seat of Government Acceptance Act and Seat of Government (Administration) Act - Ordinance No. 8 of 1930 - Leases (Special Purposes).

page 3828

COTTON INDUSTRIES BOUNTY BILL

Assent reported.

page 3828

ESTIMATES AND BUDGET PAPERS, 1930-31

Additions, NewWorks, Buildings, etc.

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · ALP

– I lay upon the table of the Senate by command -

Estimates of Expenditure for Additions, New Works, Buildings, &c. for the year ending 30th June, 1931.

The Budget, 1930-31 - Papers presented by the Right Honorable J. H. Scullin, P.C.. M.P., in connexion with the Budget of 1930-31 (Preliminary issue).

I move -

That the papers be printed.

In formulating the budget for the year 1930-31 the Government was faced with a financial depression without parallel in the thirty years’ life. of the Commonwealth. The causes of this depression have been the subject of a great deal of comment and discussion with which honorable senators are familiar. In order, however, to focus attention upon the real nature of the problem, it is proper to review again the main factors that are reacting so adversely upon our financial position.

The severe economic disturbance at present prevailing in nearly all countries has been preceded or accompanied by a disastrous collapse in commodity values. Its effect on the prices of wool, wheat, metals and other products, which constitute the major portion of Australia’s exportable production, are well known. Concurrently with the decline in the value of exports there has been a cessation of the flow of loan moneys from overseas. Drought conditions in many districts during recent seasons also have had their adverse effect by reducing the volume of primary production. The loss in Australia of real income consequent upon these factors is variously estimated for the year just closed at between £50,000,000 and £70,000,000.

An inevitable result of the reduced local spending power is reflected in curtailment of credit, reduced trade, increased unemployment and derangement of governmental finance

The ultimate effect upon Commonwealth finance has been accentuated owing to the necessity for restricting importations with the resultant sacrifice of a large proportion of the customs revenue. The fiscal and- monetary policy of Commonwealth Governments in recent years has been ill-adapted to withstand any serious upset in the trade equilibrium except by an increased dependence on the overseas loan market. The failure of the London loan market as a supplementary source of national income precipitated the monetary stringency from which the whole country is now suffering.

Upon the flow of oversea loan money becoming interrupted we were faced with a shortage of London funds with which to meet our external commitments, and to pay for services and goods purchased abroad. This was the most critical problem facing the present Government when it came into office. “We have contrived to meet the position temporarily by arranging short-dated accommodation from the bill market, advances from the Australian banks, and by overdrafts in London from the Commonwealth and Westminster Banks. But a more permanent solution of the London position must be found.

The Loan Council must secure overseas, by a long-dated loan or other means, not less than £30,000,000 in the near future in order to clear up the London position. Failure to make such provision will bring about an embarrassing situation. The difficulty arises entirely from our temporary inability to secure command of funds in London.

This situation has been causing the Commonwealth Government and the Loan Council grave concern for some time past and has been the subject of intimate negotiations with London financial houses. I am hopeful that these negotiations will prove successful and that the meeting of our London commitments will be arranged on satisfactory terms at an early date.. I have referred to the subject in plain terms and with complete candour in order that honorable senators will appreciate the gravity of the problem.

The volume of imports to this country has amounted to colossal figures in recent years, reaching the peak of £164,000,000 in 1926-27. Excluding bullion and specie, these imports exceeded exports by approximately £70,000,000 during the last six years.

When the adverse trade balance could be made good by raising long-dated credits in London the needs of the moment were met. It is clear, however, that British investors were not indifferent to the unsound economic position that had developed in Australian affairs, and equally clear that they had become unwilling to provide loan moneys for us with the same promptness and facility as before.

The opinion in Great Britain that Australia was over borrowing was greatly assisted by the fact that Australia was issuing new loans in London or New York at frequent intervals. In 1927 Australian Governments floated eleven loans overseas for a total of £69,706,000; in 1928, five loans for £30,500,000; in 1929, up to the change of government, three loans, including treasury-bills, for £25,403,000; a grand total, in less than three years, of nineteen loans for £125,609,000. That is to say, Australia during the three year period referred to put out loans at an average rate of £6,600,000 in every two months. Tt matters little. when considering the effect of this upon the public mind that, of the total above-mentioned, £36,400,000 was for conversions.

The last new money loan issued for Australia in London was a 5 per cent. 46-yenr loan issued at 98 in January, 1929. Only 16 per cent, of that loan was subscribed by the public, the balance being left with the underwriters. From the time of that issue to the present the London market has gone steadily against us. Although the necessity of new loans became more and more acute and the Loan Council sounded the position in London many times during 1929 and again in the early months of this year, no opportunity has occurred to approach, the market with an issue upon acceptable terms.

The serious decline that has taken place in the market value of Australian securities in London is indicated in the following statement. For purposes of comparison, the quotations are shown in juxtaposition with the prices of the comparable stocks of New Zealand and South Africa.

In the period from the beginning of 1929 to 30th June, 1930, Australian stocks declined in value 12f points while those of New Zealand declined only If and those of South Africa 4 points.

Taking into account the improved figures for this week, Australian stocks, in the full period covered by this table, declined in value 9£ points whilst those of New Zealand declined by 2 and those of South Africa 4£ points.

It has, I think, been brought home to all of us that the time is long overdue when borrowing abroad should be reduced to a minimum, and that the domestic market should be relied upon to provide the bulk of the moneys necessary for developmental works. To revert to the overseas market for borrowing on the scale which obtained during the last few years, even if the market were accessible to us, would be merely postponing the day of reckoning, and, now that we are facing that reckoning, it should be done resolutely and with a fixed determination to arrive at a satisfactory and permanent solution of the problem.

The objective to be aimed at is to so adjust Australia’s overseas trade that the surplus of exports over imports together with the reduced borrowing that may be possible on the London and New York markets, in the future, will be sufficient to meet the requirements of the Commonwealth and State Governments for commitments abroad.

To this end, the Government has materially increased the customs tariff on luxuries and non-essential articles, has rationed the imports of some articles and placed an absolute prohibition on the import of certain other articles.

The Australian banks have also given valuable assistance in this direction by rationing London exchange to their importing clients. In addition, the increase in the rate of exchange on London is an important factor which will operate towards restoring the balance of trade. In July last, £101 in Australia would buy a telegraphic transfer of £100 to London; to-day it would cost £106 10s. for the same purpose. The additional cost of London funds, whilst operating adversely to the importer, replaces to some extent the reduced returns to the primary producer from the sale of his exported products.

In December last the Government brought down a measure, which was approved by Parliament, authorizing the mobilization of the gold resources of the Commonwealth. By this means, gold, which had been lying idle in the vaults of the banks, became an active influence in assisting the London exchange position. During the financial year, gold to the value of approximately £27,000,000 was transferred overseas, but obviously this cannot become a recurring operation on so large a scale. When the gold holdings of the Commonwealth Bank are reduced to such an amount as is necessary for the seasonal expansion of the note issue and the statutory gold reserve, the gold available for export will be limited to new production approximating £2,000,000 per annum.

It may be necessary in order to make sure of future government requirements in London being met to invite the trading banks to pool their external exchange and give the Commonwealth and State Governments first call upon their London funds.

It is not claimed that a permanent settlement of our financial difficulties can be obtained by the methods outlined. At the best, they are temporary, and, in some cases, drastic expedients imposed to meet an emergent situation. In due course, when they have fulfilled their purpose, these temporary expedients will be removed. It is confidently expected that, in the meantime, Australia’s secondary industries will have so expanded that much of the manufactured goods imported in the past will be replaced by goods of local manufacture resulting in a substantial permanent reduction in the volume of imports.

Sitting suspended from 6.15 to 8 p.m.

Senator DALY:

– On coming into office in October last, the Government found the following position : -

The accumulated deficit at 30th June, 1929, was £4,987,718.

An examination of the Consolidated Revenue position as at the date of the change of government disclosed that’ a further deficit in the current year’s accounts would be inevitable. Towards meeting this, the present Government imposed additional taxation, but due mainly to the reduced volume of imports the year finished with a deficit of £1,470,164.

At the end of September, 1929, the Commonwealth Government cash balances showed a credit balance of £420,000 in Australia, but a debit balance of £3,370,000 in London - thus a net debit balance in the Commonwealth cash accounts of nearly £3,000,000.

The total new money required for the 1929-30 loan programmes of the Commonwealth and the States, and to cover arrears of borrowing and deficits to be funded, was £42,000,000. In addition, the Government was faced with the task of providing within one year of assum ing office, for the conversion or redemption in Australia, of £71,000,000 of maturing Commonwealth loans.

Financial Results, 1929-30

The transactions of the financial year 1929-30 resulted as follows : -

As against this deficit, it should be remembered that during the year £4,164,032 was provided from Commonwealth revenue for the redemption of Commonwealth debt and £994,433 was provided from Commonwealth revenue for the redemption of States’ debts.

Last year the present Government budgeted for revenue of £64,589,000. The actual revenue shows a shortage of £1,542,697, a sum approximately the same as the deficit for the year.

Of the total revenue, £58,187,777 came . from direct and indirect taxation, whilst other revenue totalled £4,858,526. Customs and excise revenue was £2,675,609 less than the estimate. This loss of revenue was largely due to the restrictions imposed on imports, which have already been referred to. From direct taxation, we received £968,386 more than was estimated, the chief increase being £535,030 under income tax.

It was anticipated that the business undertakings would show a surplus of £176,601 for the year. Instead, however, there was a loss of £125,683. This was due to the diminution of postal receipts and of Trans-Australian railway earnings.

The expenditure on the departments and general services was £340,759 less than the estimate. The chief item of decrease was interest and sinking funds on war loans, which was £603,455 less than the anticipated payments. Under the war conversion operation of March last, interest on converted holdings of the December, 1930, loan became payable in September and March of each year instead of in June and December. Whilst there was no loss of interest to the bond owners, one result of the conversion wa3 to relieve last year’s Commonwealth accounts of three months’ interest on the converted holdings.

Last year it was necessary to increase the amount provided by the former Government for invalid and old-age pensions from £10,300,000 to £10,600,000. Even this increased amount proved to be inadequate, the final expenditure being £10,791,326. There was a large increase in the applications for pensions, due to lbc extent of unemployment.

A saving of £91,432 was secured under the ordinary votes of departments, the expenditure being £2,950,4’59, as against the estimate of £3,041,891. The expenditure for the year was less than that for 1927-28 and 1928-29.

Under miscellaneous services there was an increase of £232,667, the expenditure being £619,504, as compared with the estimate of £3S6,837. Of the increase, £17.1,000 was for interest on overdrafts in London and £S5,000 represented exchange on the remittance of funds to London. It is necessary for the Government to secure all possible London exchange despite the fact that the exchange rate is over £6 per £100.

The Accumulated Deficit

The accumulated deficit of £4,987,718 at 30th June, 1929, has now been increased to £6,457,882. In view of the abnormal financial conditions at present existing, the Government does not propose to provide for the reduction of the accumulated deficit during the current financial year. To raise additional taxation for this purpose in a year when the income of Australia is greatly depleted and ordinary revenue yields much less than it would in a normal year, would be to place too great a burden on the nation. With a return to normal conditions, and a substantial increase of exports, it should be possible to provide for the liquidation of the deficit o’ver a relatively short period of years. In the meantime, the deficit will he temporarily covered by means of a loan appropriation of £7,000,000, which was voted “ to be paid to the Consolidated Revenue Fund.”

Parliament must recognize, however, that no further drift in Commonwealth finances can be permitted, and that the balancing of the budget is an essential step for the restoration of the credit of Australia. The Government proposes to watch the financial position closely throughout the year, and without waiting until the end of the financial year, will not hesitate to take immediate steps if such action appears to be necessary in order to prevent any serious disturbance in the budgetary position.

Review of Commonwealth Expenditure

In any examination of the financial difficulties of the Commonwealth, we must not overlook the enormous annual burden attributable to the war. The Commonwealth must raise more than £30,000,000 per year in taxation to pay the direct and inescapable charges for interest and sinking fund on war debt, and for war pensions and repatriation services. In addition there are other indirect war charges which contribute to the cost of government in many ways. The war has laid a heavy burden upon all the combatants. In times of financial stress such as the present the crippling effect of our increasing war obligations is grievously felt.

In part 1 of the Consolidated Revenue Fund - that is, departments and services other than business undertakings and territories - the total expenditure for 1929-30 was £52,302,742. The following expenditures included in that total are almost wholly payable under statutory appropriations which are not controllable by the administration: -

Of the balance, £7,186,372, more than £4,000,000 is absorbed by the Defence

Department and about £3,000,000 by the ordinary departments. Those who talk of cutting millions out of this expenditure have not sufficiently considered the problem.

Drastic cuts have been made in the Defence Department. A reduction of £150,000 was made in the appropriations for the year just closed and a further reduction of £500,000 is being made in this year. It will be impossible to make further reductions without resorting to drastic retrenchment of the personnel and seriously impairing the whole defence organization.

By the reorganization of the work of the Development and Migration Commission a substantial (saving in administrative and other contributory expenses has been secured. The expenditure from revenue this year will be £50,709 less than the amount appropriated last year, and £60,746 less than the actual expenditure in 1928-29. As the reorganization was effected during the course of the year 1929-30, the expenditure for that year was £16,880 less than the amount appropriated. In addition to the savings on revenue votes, passage money appropriations, which were formerly met from the Loan Fund, have been reduced by £80,000- from £100,000 last year to £20,000 this year.

Administrative expenses in connexion with the Federal Capital Territory have been reduced by £30,000.

The ordinary votes of the Government Departments have been subjected to the closest scrutiny. The total appropriation is lower now than it was in any year during the last four years, notwithstanding the increased cost of living allowances payable to officers of the Public Service.

It must be remembered that there is always a natural increase in administrative expenditure due in part to an extension of existing services, as well as to the demands of a growing population. Notwithstanding this natural increase the Government, by careful control, was enabled to keep the expenditure last year £91,432 below the amount appropriated.

The Government has been in office only eight months and it has been impossible in that short period to exhaust all possibilities of reducing expenditure. Earnest efforts have been made to cut out unnecessary expenditure. It is the intention of the Government to continue a close scrutiny of departmental expenditure throughout the. year and it is confidently hoped that the result will be a substantial reduction in expenditure as compared with the amount estimated.

A careful examination of departmental expenditure shows that any large saving can be achieved only at the expense of salaries, and other emoluments and by retrenchment of staff, which, as a result of rigid control, is not at present overloaded.

The extra cost of living allowance which has been awarded to the public servants and is incorporated in the current year’s Estimates, is the result of arbitration awards. It may seem anomalous that at a time when commodity costs are falling the Public Service should enjoy increments in salary owing to “increased cost of living”. It must be remembered that the computation is based upon the twelve months’ figures for the period prior to March in each year and that, therefore, there’ is always a lag between the increase in the cost of living and the automatic increase in salary enjoyed by the Government employees. If the cost of living continues to decline the Public Service will, next year, by the operation of the same awards, be subject to an automatic reduction of salary.

Invalid and Old-age Pensions.

Increased numbers of claims for invalid and old-age pensions have resulted in heavy additions to the annual expenditure under this heading, the figures being - ‘

During 1929-30 the number of pensions in force increased by 13,959, which constituted the largest addition in any one year. This heavy increase may be attributed to the present industrial depression. On the 30th June, 1930, there were 155,196 old-age and 63,304 invalid pensions in force.

War Pensions and Repatriation

The estimated expenditure on war pensions in 1930-31 is £7,957,000, as compared with £7,897,289 in 1929-30. It will thus be seen that the peak period for war pensions has not yet been reached, though it was generally considered that 1930 would be the peak year. It is estimated that the number of pensioners will increase from 278,318 on 31st May, 1930, to 284,000 on 30th June, 1931, owing chiefly to the increasing number of pensioned wives and children and to pensions granted by the Appeal Tribunals. General repatriation expenses are expected to increase from £1,044,000 in 1929-30 to £1,125,314 in 1930-31. These figures represent the net expenditure, after allowing for repayments of loans and other miscellaneous receipts.

Excluding war pensions, the principal items in the gross expenditure for 1930-31 may be compared with those for 1925-26 as under : -

It will be seen that the cost of administration has decreased by £9,336, but the benefits to ex-soldiers and their dependants have increased by £249,054.

Despite the lapse of time since the conclusion of the war, repatriation expenditure continues to grow.

Defence

In view of the present adverse position of Commonwealth finances, the Government has found it necessary to reduce financial allotments for defence purposes for 1930-31 to £3,767,000 from revenue and £129,800 from loan fund, as compared with £4,267,000 and £246,500 respectively in 1929-30. The revenue savings thus total £500,000 and the loan £116,700.

As a result, curtailment of certain activities in the Royal Australian Navy is necessary, the ships in commission being reduced to H.M.A.S. Australia, H.M.A.S.

Canberra, cruisers; H.M.A.S. Albatross, seaplane carrier, and H.M.A.S. Anzac, flotilla leader ; the following ships having been paid off into reserve during 1929-30 - H.M.A.S. Swordsman, H.M.A.S. Success, H.M.A.S. Moresby, H.M.A.S. Oxley, and H.M.A.S. Otway, these factors enabling reduction of establishments of seagoing personnel by 61 officers and 639 men, including five officers and 76 men on loan from the Royal Navy who have been returned to England. Of the total establishment of the sea-going forces, Royal Naval personnel now approximate 3 per cent, only - the lowest percentage yet recorded.

Reductions in the personnel of the Permanent Military Forces total 92, representing the abolition of vacant positions. The change from compulsory to voluntary enlistment, combined with the consequent reductions in establishments from 47,500 to 35,000 militia, and senior cadets from 16,700 to 7,000 leaves the Permanent Forces over-staffed to a certain extent. To obviate hardship that would result from dismissals, a scheme of enforced leave - not to exceed eight weeks per annum - has been introduced as a temporary expedient, but no member will receive less than the basic wage under this scheme. Royal Australian Air Force establishment has been reduced by three officers and 34 airmen, but as this force has been working below establishment, no dismissals will be involved.

Approximately 100 employees have been discharged from munitions establishments - a substantial proportion of these discharges being due to completion of the development programme. By extension of the policy of acceptance by factories of orders from commercial firms, further dismissals of any magnitude appear improbable.

For purposes of economy it has been decided to transfer the Royal Naval College from Jervis Bay to Flinders Naval Depot where it will function as from the end of July, while, for similar reasons, the question of transferring the Royal Military College from Duntroon to military buildings available elsewhere is at present receiving consideration.

Civil Aviation. - All subsidized services functioning in 1929-30 - with the exception of those carried out by the-

Larkin Aircraft Supply Company Limited in Victoria, New South Wales and South Australia, which were discontinued at date of expiration of agreement on 9th June, 1930, owing entirely to passenger traffic, mails and freight not justifying their continuance - will be maintained during 1930-31, while an extension of the service through the Kimberley district of North-West Australia from Derby to Wyndham, 600 miles, will commence in July, 1930 - such service to be operated during the “ dry “ season only, eight months per annum.

General. - As the result of sums available for defence purposes in 1930-31 being £616,700 less than those appropriated in 1929-30, all defence activities have been very carefully investigated and reviewed. With the object of maintaining the existing high standard of efficiency of the Forces, the necessary economies have been effected in the least essential services.

Federal Aid Roads

During the last four years, the Commonwealth has paid the States £2,000,000 per annum under a ten-year agreement relating to Federal Aid Roads. Under this agreement the States were required to contribute 15s. for each £1 provided by the Commonwealth, and conditions were laid down as to the classes of roads on which the money should be spent. The Commonwealth also had the right of supervision.

The present Commonwealth Government has no desire to exercise any control over the activities of the States in relation to roads. It is, however, prepared to continue to contribute £2,000,000 per annum to the States for roads expenditure.

As the result of conferences on this matter a general agreement has been reached. Under it, the Commonwealth will pay to the States, during a period of 10J years as from 1st July, 1926, £2,000,000 per annum. The States will undertake to spend this money on the construction, reconstruction, maintenance, or repair of roads. They will not, however, be under any obligation to contribute any particular sum for roads expenditure from their own funds, nor will the Commonwealth exercise any supervision over the work of the States in this connexion.

A formal agreement on these lines has been submitted to the States, and will, at a later date, be placed before Parliament for ratification.

Unemployment

The number of unemployed workers in the Commonwealth has grown steadily during the last eighteen months. Rut for the additional protection to local industry afforded by the recent tariff adjustments, the position to-day would undoubtedly have been much worse.

A sound national insurance scheme extended to unemployment, if it had operated a sufficient length of time, would have gone a long way towards mitigating the distress endured by the workers in the present crisis. Such schemes, however, imposing as they do additional charges upon industry, should be initiated only in normal times, when there is a reasonable prospect that through a succession of prosperous years insurance funds will be built up with sufficient strength to withstand the heavy drain in times of stress.

The Commonwealth Government, however, recognizing the dire straits of many of the workers and their families throughout the country, has done what is practicable, with the limited resources available, to afford some relief. In addition to the assistance to industry granted through the protective duties, arrangements were made with the Commonwealth Bank to extend credits through State institutions and the trading, banks for the stimulation of primary and secondary production. It is hoped that when the central reserve bank is established, and commences operations, the credit resources of the Commonwealth will be better mobilized and made more readily available for the legitimate trade and industrial needs of the community, thus opening up new avenues of employment as well as extending existing avenues.

The Government has undertaken to distribute among the States a grant of £1,000,000, to be used for the purposes of immediate relief of unemployment. This will be in addition to the amount of £1,000,000 provided from Commonwealth revenue for road construction purposes, some months ago. Additional funds were provided for the Postmaster-General’s Department enabling employees, who would otherwise have been dismissed, to be retained to the number of 1,720. In addition, expenditure is being specially incurred in the Federal Capital Territory and in North Australia with the object of providing work for the unemployed.

Postmaster-General’s Department

Telegraph. Telephone and Broadcasting Services

As a result of adverse financial and business conditions, telephone installations fell from 29,000 in 1928-29 to 15,000 last year. The total number of telephones now in use in the Commonwealth is 521,000. Australia occupies sixth place in the world in the number of telephones per head of the population.

Progress has been made in the establishment of automatic exchanges, eleven having been brought into service during the year, and tenders have been invited for apparatus necessary for further extensions of the system in rural areas.

Developments in long-distance telephony during the past year have been striking. Most prominent is the inauguration, on the 30th April last, of the service between Australia and Great Britain. Extensions of this over-ocean service have been and are now being made to many other European countries, and investigations are in progress regarding a service with New Zealand. In Australia, about 8,000 additional miles of trunk telephone lines were added to the system last year, and the method of superimposing several channels of communication upon an existing line has resulted in the equivalent of a further wire mileage of 10,000 miles. The linking up of capitals will be advanced by the Perth-Adelaide service, which it is anticipated will be opened before the end of 1930, and proposals for the telephonic linking of Tasmania with the mainland will be submitted to Parliament at an early date.

The rates for- telephone services were recently increased, as the service was being conducted at a loss. Notwithstanding the increase, telephone facilities cost less in Australia than in other parts of the world; many facilities in country districts are provided below cost.

Telegraphs

He-organization in regard to the Telegraph Branch has resulted in a reduction of £170,000 in working expenditure over the two financial years to 30th June, 1930, but, notwithstanding this, the decline in earnings still prevents the branch from showing a profit. Technical improvements have also been made in many directions during the year, amongst which may be mentioned the abolition of a number of repeating stations in favour of direct communication between the country towns and capital cities, and provision of additional facilities for intercapital communication. At the end of 1930 it is expected Perth will be in direct communication with all other State capitals except Hobart.

Broadcasting

National broadcasting services are now in operation in every State except Tasmania, which will participate on the expiration of the existing licence on the 18th December next.

The Government is anxious to improve the service throughout the Commonwealth as widely and rapidly as conditions will allow. Our programme includes installations in selected country districts of subsidiary stations to improve reception. It is expected that five such stations will be completed before the end of 1930-31, and provision is being made in the Estimates for still further stations. The number of licences continues to increase, there being 311,322 at the end of May, 1930, as compared with 298,551 at that date in 1929.

Commonwealth Railways

Working expenses and interest on Commonwealth railways absorbed £1,108,423 last year. The revenue was £418,037, so that there was a loss of £690,386, after providing for interest.

The position is expected to be slightly better this year, the estimated loss being £630,200.

These railways were provided to fulfil obligations arising out of federation.

Loan Operations, 1929-30

Apart from two issues of short-term treasury-bills, the only loan operation conducted overseas during the year just closed was the conversion of £3,781,700, 3$ per- cent. Queensland stock which matured in London on 1st July, 1930. This conversion was effected by the issue of Queensland securities guaranteed by the Commonwealth and bearing interest at 5 per cent, per annum, the issue price being £97, and the currency six years, with a right to the Government to redeem the loan after four years.

As regards Australian borrowing, two public flotations of £10,000,000 were authorized by the Australian Loan Council to provide funds for public works for the Commonwealth and the States. The first loan was raised in November last, the terms being 54 per cent, at £98, the loan maturing in 1934. The second loan is now on issue; the interest rate is 6 per cent, at par, and the loan matures on 15th November, 193S. A satisfactory response is being made by the public to this loan.

The most important operation during the year was the conversion and redemption of the £10,362,000 6 per cent, loan, which matured on 15th March last, with which was associated a conversion offer to holders in the 6 per cent, war loan for £60,000,000 odd maturing on 15th December next.

The new terms offered were 6 per cent, at par for a period of seven years.

Of a total of over £70,000,000 maturing in March and December of this year. £48,000,000 was covered by this operation. Allowing for available sinking funds, the balance of the December loan to be provided for later in the year will be approximately £18,000,000.

In February last, when the conversion offer was made, there was some apprehension as to our power to deal with this huge sum, without at least some assistance from the oversea market. The result of the conversion offer has proved the operation to be within the capacity of our own resources, and we confidently look forward to making satisfactory arrangements in regard to the balance of the loan when it matures in December next.

The estimated and actual expenditure compare as follows: -

The net loan expenditure for 1929-30 was £2,872,850 less than the corresponding expenditure for 1928-29, and £1,009,185 less than the amount provided in 1929-30 for debt redemption.

Loan Expenditure, 1930-31

The loan expenditure of the Commonwealth and the States, which had averaged £43,000,000 for some years, was reduced last year to less than £30,000,000. In view of the general financial situation, the Loan Council decided that further drastic reductions were necessary in the loan expenditure for 1930-31. Appropriate reductions are accordingly being made in the loan programmes of the Commonwealth and of each State. The policy of the Loan Council is to confine its borrowing in the future almost wholly to the Australian market instead of relying, as in the past, mainly on the overseas market.

The estimated expenditure represents less than half the average annual Commonwealth loan expenditure for the four years 1925-26 to 1928-29.

Loan expenditure of the Commonwealth has now been reduced to a sum considerably less than the amount applied by the Commonwealth towards the redemption of its public debt. Thus, though we are continuing to provide considerable sums for revenue producing assets such as post office works and war service homes, the gross public debt is being definitely reduced each year.

As against loan expenditure of £4,127,000 estimated for the current year, the amount available for debt redemption will be £6,792,363.

The proposed loan expenditures in 1930-31 compare with the expenditure in 1928-29 and 1929-30 as follow:-

Works under the Migration Agreement are expected to absorb £800,000. This sum is included in the loan programmes of the States.

Debt Redemption

Commonwealth

The amount applied towards the redemption of Commonwealth debt in 1929-30 was £6,367,482. The sources from which these funds came were -

The amount which will be available for 1930-31 is estimated at £6,792,363.

State

The amounts made available from the National Debt Sinking Fund for the redemption of State debts in 1929-30 were -

The amount to be provided in 1930-31 is estimated at £3,429,000.

Total Debt Redemption

Combining the Commonwealth and State figures, the total amount made available last year for the redemption of Australian debts was £9,537,259. The actual payments in redemption of debt during 1929-30 totalled £7,021,205 in Australia and £3,466,483 overseas. These sums included balances brought forward from the previous year.

For 1930-31, the amount which will be available for the redemption of Commonwealth and State debts is estimated at £10,221,363.

Soldier Land Settlement

In 1927 the Commonwealth, with the concurrence of the States, appointed Mr. Justice Pike to investigate soldier land settlement, the chief object being to secure a correct account of the losses incurred, and a basis for a financial settlement as between the Commonwealth and the States.

On receipt of Mr. Justice Pike’s report, the late Government asked the States to agree to a settlement on the basis proposed by him, subject to the condition that the interest concession made by the Commonwealth to the States in 1925 be varied so that after 31st December, 1930, the States and- the Commonwealth should share equally any liability in excess of 5 per centum per annum for interest payable on the Commonwealth loans from which the money due by the States to the Commonwealth for soldier land settlement was provided.

The position was discussed at a recent conference of Commonwealth and State Ministers, and it was agreed that a settlement be made based solely on the recommendations of Mr. Justice Pike, the Commonwealth undertaking not to vary the interest concession referred to.

Such a variation would have given considerable relief to the Commonwealth, but inasmuch as it was a departure from the recommendation of the investigating authority, the Government felt that to insist on it was inconsistent and unfair to the States. Moreover, this concession which provided that, after 31st December, 1930, interest should be paid by the States at the rate of 5 per cent, per annum on all loans outstanding on that date, had been included in an agreement which had been ratified by four State Parliaments. The terms of settlement are -

That the basis suggested by Mr. Justice Pike, viz., that the Commonwealth and States share equally in the losses, be accepted, and that, to give effect to this decision, the Commonwealth assume responsibility as at 30th June, 1927, for a further amount of £2,447,000 of the soldier settlement loans owing by the States.
That a condition of such acceptance be the completion of the satisfactory settlement of the soldier settlers now on the land, particularly in respect to the provision of home maintenance areas.
That, in order to cover losses to be incurred in providing home maintenance areas, the further loss on that account be taken as £300,000, and that £150,000 be added to the Commonwealth’s share of the loss, making, say, £2,000,000; the £150,000 to be allocated to the States affected on the basis of the number of soldier settlers now on the land. This clause applies to New South Wales (outside irrigation areas), Victoria, Queensland, and Tasmania.
That this settlement be full and final.

The arrangements now made will involve the Commonwealth in the payment of arrears of interest totalling £284,000.

A new agreement is now being drawn up, and legislation will be introduced by the Commonwealth and each State for its ratification.

In 1925, the Commonwealth agreed to assume responsibility for £5,000,000 of soldier settlement loans owing by the States. By the adoption of Mr. Justice Pike’s basis of settlement, the Commonwealth will assume liability for a further sum of £2,600,000 of soldier settlement loans owing by the’ States, making the total of this debt adjustment £7,600,000. Under the original arrangements, the Commonwealth contributed £4,735,000 by allowing the States a rebate of interest on loan moneys raised for them by the Commonwealth. In addition, the Commonwealth paid sustenance allowances to soldier settlers of approximately £500,000.

As against this decrease of £4,914,293 in the recorded debt there was a net overdraft of an approximately similar sum in Commonwealth Bank accounts at 30th June, 1930.

The debt at 30th June, 1930, is domiciled as follows : -

The London debt includes the amount due under the war funding arrangement with Great Britain, which originally was £92,480;156, and now stands at £81,294,582.

War debt was reduced during the year by £5,723,345, while works debt increased by £809,052.

Of the gross Commonwealth debt of £372,707,279, due at 30th June, 1930, loan balances in hand and sums repayable to the Treasury amounted to approximately £23,000,000, leaving the net debt at £349,707,279, as against £349,356,349 on 30th June, 1929.

States

Iu accordance with the provisions of the Financial Agreement, the Commonwealth, on 1st July, 1929, took over the outstanding debt incurred by or on behalf of the States, and assumed, as between the Commonwealth and the States, the liabilities of the States to bond-holders. The debt at 1st July, 1929, amounted to £726,406,490. On 30th June, 1930, debt on account of the States stood at £727,643,712, an increase during the year of £1,237,223.

Total Commonwealth and States Public Debt

At 30th June, 1930, Commonwealth and State public debt combined aggregated approximately £1,100,350,991, as against £1,104,028,062 on 30th June, 1929.

German Reparations

At the recent Hague Conference a final settlement of the problems of German reparation was effected, based on a plan recommended by a committee of experts and known as the “New Plan.” Under this settlement Australia will receive an average annuity of £864,000 for 37 years.

On the 17th January, 1930, an agreement relating to the liquidation of exenemy property was signed at the Hague by Australia and Germany. Under this agreement, Australia has ceased the liquidation of German property in Australia and New Guinea, but retains the proceeds of past liquidations. It is estimated that these liquidations will eventually realize about £4,000,000, which will be applied towards the redemption of Commonwealth debt. The value of the property to be handed back to former German owners is estimated at about £266,000.

Commonwealth Bank of Australia

Proposals are now before Parliament for the establishment of a central reserve bank for Australia. It is intended that this new bank shall undertake all necessary central banking functions, including those now performed by the Commonwealth Bank. A bill to remodel the Commonwealth Bank on the establishment of the central reserve bank has also been introduced.

The profits of the bank, excluding the note issue, during the last two calendar years, were as follow: -

The profits of the general bank increased by £105,425 and those of the Rural Credits Department by £14,920, whilst the savings bank profits fell by £78,183, this decrease being due to the higher rate of interest now being paid to depositors.

Note Issue Department

The profits of the Note Issue Department for the year ended 30th June, 1930, were £938,225, of which £703,669 wai paid to Commonwealth revenue and £234,556 was transferred to the Rural Credits Capital Account of the bank.

The notes in circulation and the gold reserve at the 30th June, 1930, were respectively £44,914,326 and £19,931,102. At the corresponding date in the previous year these totals were £42,408,226 and £22,651,496.

During the year, the value of the notes held by the public fell by about £2,200,000, while the value of the notes in the hands of the banks increased bv approximately £4.700,000.

Estimated Expenditure, 1930-31,

The charges to be borne by the general revenue in 1930-31 compare with those for 1929-30 as under :-

Under departments and general services, the principal increases are -

It is quite impracticable for the Commonwealth to avoid the increases above set out.

The payments to the States include an additional amount of £1,000,000 to cover the grant to the States for unemployment to which reference has already been made.

Budget Position, 1930-31

After exhaustively reviewing the expenditure for 1930-31 and making all possible reductions therein, the Government found that, allowing for the expected yields of taxation and other revenue on the present basis, it would be faced with a shortage of revenue in the present year of £14,038,770.

The details of the shortage are as follows : -

It was obvious that such a wide gap could not be bridged without increased taxation, and moreover it is necessary that such increased taxation should operate as early as possible in the new” year. To enable the taxation measures to be proceeded with immediately it was decided to bring down the budget, based on group totals of estimated expenditure for 1930-31. The approximate expenditure for 1929-30 in the same groups is also supplied for the purpose of comparison.

It is hoped that it will be possible to present the main estimates in a fortnight’s time, when the usual full set of budget papers will be circulated. For th* present I am distributing, for the information of honorable senators, such of the budget papers as are essential to the general budget debate.

In determining the necessary new taxes and charges, the Government has exercised great care with a view to spreading their incidence as fairly and as widely as possible so that an undue burden may not fall on any one section of the community and there may be the least possible disturbance of industry. Regard was paid also to the existing State taxes which preclude the Commonwealth from imposing heavy additional taxes in fields in which the States also operate.

It being essential that the budget should be balanced, the Government has adopted the following proposals to cover the shortage of £14,038,770:-

With this new revenue, the budget for 1930-31 will be balanced.

Estimated Revenue, 1930-31

Customs and Excise

The expected yield of customs and excise duties for 1930-31 under the present tariff is £34,000,000. This represents a loss of £7,774,391 as compared with the yield of these revenues in 1929-30.. This loss inevitably followed the restrictions recently placed on imports with a view to correcting the adverse balance of trade. Towards making good this loss of customs and excise revenue, the Government proposes to impose new revenue duties estimated to yield during the present year the sum of £5,700,000. This will bring the estimated revenue from customs and excise to £39,700,000, which is approximately £2,000,000 less than the yield last year. The proposed new customs and excise duties are -

Customs duties -

A primage duty of 2½ per cent.

Increases in existing duties -

Petrol - 3d. per gallon.

Tobacco -6d. per lb.

Cigarettes -1s. per lb.

Cigars - 2s. per lb.

Films -1d. per foot.

Newsprint - £1 per ton.

Wireless valves - 10 per cent.

Excise duties -

Increases in existing duties -

Beer - 2d. per gallon.

Petrol - 3d. per gallon.

Cigarettes - 3d. per lb.

Sales Tax

It is proposed to collect additional revenue amounting to £5,000,000 during the current financial year by means of a sales tax of 2½ per cent, on the sale prices of commodities sold in Australia other than, those which are to he exempted. A full year’s revenue from this source is estimated at £6,250,000 on a total taxable field of £250,000,000.

The tax will not apply ‘ to any sales made by primary producers, or to any sales of goods for export from Australia, or in respect of goods exported before sale abroad.

Sales of the following goods will be exempt from the tax in all circumstances : -

Milk, butter, cheese, condensed milk, meat, wheat, flour, sugar, bread and pastry, potatoes, market garden produce, orchard produce, eggs, poultry, other dairy produce, fish, grapes, hay and straw, sundry other crops, coal, articles covered by the new special revenue duties, and manufactures of government workshops.

The field of taxable sales includes all imported goods sold for consumption in Australia and all goods produced or manufactured in Australia other than those specified as exempt.

The tax on imported goods will be payable at the time the goods are being cleared from customs control, unless the importer is a wholesaler or a manufacturer who is licensed under the law relating to the sales tax. Licences will he issued to approved wholesalers and manufacturers in order that they may pay the tax upon imported goods at the time they sell them to a retailer or to the public direct. This will enable manufacturers to obtain necessary materials and articles for purposes of their factories without paying sales tax at the time of importation. When these materials and articles have been wrought into or attached to other articles made by the manufacturer, thus forming part of that article, their selling value will form part of the total sale price upon which the manufacturer will be required to pay the sales tax.

Licensed wholesalers and licensed manufacturers who sell to other licensed wholesalers or licensed manufacturers will not pay the tax on such sales, as the tax will be subsequently paid by the purchasing licensed wholesaler or manufacturer when he sells to the retailer or to the public.

The basis of the scheme of this tax is similar to that of the sales tax at present in force in the Dominion of Canada.

It is intended that vendors who make taxable sales shall render monthly accounts to the Commissioner of Taxation and shall send with those accounts a remittance of the tax payable in respect of those sales.

Provision will be made to allow adjustments in regard to bad debts in respect of which sales tax has been paid.

It is not intended to allow a refund of sales tax in respect of imported goods which are subsequently exported unless and until a drawback of customs duty, if any, payable on the goods, has been certified to by the proper authority. If goods which are free of customs duty are exported from Australia outside customs control a refund of sales tax will not be granted.

Postage Charges

The alterations in postage contemplate reversion to the 1923 rates so far as letters and postcards are concerned, excepting that the unit of weight for letters will be 1 oz. The postage on letters and lettercards will therefore be 2d. per oz. and on postcards 1-Jd. each. Minor adjustments are being made in regard to certain other classes of mail matter.

The estimated additional revenue is £1,000,000.

Income Tax

It is proposed to raise a total amount of £10,100,000 from income tax during the present financial year. Qf this amount £850,000 will be secured by increases in the existing rates of tax, and £150,000 from amendments in the Income Tax Assessment Act as contained in the bill now before the Parliament.

The proposed increases in rates and the estimated additional revenue from the increases aTe: -

Other Receipts

The accumulated income arising from the liquidation of ex-enemy properties was invested from time to time in Commonwealth securities. During 1929-30 steps were taken to liquidate these securities, and it is expected- that by the end of 1930-31 a sum of £1,500,000 will be available from these sources for payment to the Commonwealth revenue. This sum will assist in balancing the budget for the present year.

Taxation Per Head

Although the additional taxation and charges involve a sum of £12,550,000, it is proper to regard a great proportion of this as imposts to replace, and not to supplement, the taxation of previous years. The following table setting out the Commonwealth taxation per head for the last six years in comparison with the estimated tax for the new financial year will illustrate this fact: -

It will be seen that notwithstanding the increased taxation imposed for the current year, the per capita taxation will be less than that of 1927.

Conclusion

I have now placed before honorable senators a full and frank statement of our finances - withholding nothing and exaggerating nothing.

Our loan expenditures have been cut practically in half and can now be provided almost wholly by our own people.

Our sinking funds are sound. Through t hem, Australia is providing over £10,000,000 per annum for debt redemption.

Effective steps have been taken to reduce imports and encourage local manufactures and action has been taken to stimulate exports. With the co-operation of the Australian banks in the matter of exchange, the balance of trade should t urn in our favour, thus providing means for meeting our future oversea com mitments.

Difficult though our position is, there are definite signs of improvement. Australia has recently demonstrated its capacity to manage its huge local war conversions without oversea assistance, and the present £10,000,000 loan promises to be a complete success.

The Government is determined to balance the budget and to take all measures necessary to ensure the honoring of our obligations, both at home and abroad.

Debate (on motion by Senator McLachlan) adjourned.

page 3844

BANKRUPTCY BILL

Second Reading

Consideration resumed from 2nd July (vide page 3506) on motion by Senator Daly -

That the bill bc now reada second time.

Senator McLACHLAN:
South Australia

– Honorable senators, I am sure, deplore with the Leader of the Government (Senator Daly) the necessity for this measure, because of the increase in the bankruptcy business throughout Australia. The Government has seen fit to second a judge of the Arbitration Court for the purpose of administering the Bankruptcy Act. There is no objec tion to the bill. Representations havebeen made to some honorable senators in respect of certain urgent amendmentswhich are considered necessary to the act. in addition to the proposals of the Government. I shall content myself by outlining the nature of those amendments.. A slight technical defect has been found, in section 91 of the act which deals with the bankrupt’s property. Objection is also taken to the exclusive character of section 158 which prevents proceedingsunder part 12 of the act once a meeting is called under part 11. Part 11 of the act is similar to the South Australian legislation. Part 12 of the act is similar to New South Wales legislation. Another difficulty arises under section 197 in respect of the execution of deeds. I shall explain these amendments fully in the committee stage. I give my wholehearted support to the measure.

Senator THOMPSON:
Queensland

– I took considerable interest in the original bill when it was before the Senate, with a view to the inclusion of some of the useful provisions of the Queensland Insolvency Act, brought into existence by that great lawyer, the late Sir Samuel Griffith. My efforts were opposed by lawyer senators who, I am afraid, had had little practice in bankruptcy matters, with the result that a measure of many defects, which are now being exemplified, came into operation. Quite recently I received a letter from a mercantile friend from which I quote as follows : -

Where the Bankruptcy Act is invoked its uselessness is exemplified. I told you previously of the difficulty in serving any documents in connexion with the operation of this net. The last . experience we had in connexion with preferential payments showed that the act provides thatyou have to go before a court and prove your case. The payment can be judged good if the bankrupt says the payment, was made on legal advice and that it was made in good faith. In a particular case we are interested in, months have elapsed since proceedings were taken with the result that it would be almost impossible to recover now. There were two important payments made in this matter which were undoubtedly preferential, and every day of delay makes recovery less likely, even should judgment be favorable in one case, and in the other a payment was made to the bankrupt’s mother who is now somewhere in Victoria, and it would be hard to estimate what the expenses would bc to endeavour to recover from her. These are only two of the many obstacles, occurring in the act. 1 offer no objection to the present proposals, but suggest that the Government should later on give an opportunity to amend this act to make it a better working piece of legislative machinery.

Senator McLachlan:

– That is in contemplation at the present time.

Senator THOMPSON:

– I am glad to hear it. I suggest that a committee of the Senate, not a select committee, nor a committee based on States’ representation, but one whose members would have some knowledge of the subject, should be appointed to assist in improving the bill.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH (Western Australia) [‘8.13]. - I do not intend to offer any obstacle to the bill nor to delay the Senate for more than a few minutes, but I cannot allow this opportunity to pass without expressing my deep regret, which I am sure is shared throughout Australia, that past governments and past parliaments, having waited for more than a quarter of a century before exercising Commonwealth power in regard to bankruptcy, failed to devise means of giving Australia a uniform bankruptcy law without increasing the cost of administration. During the sitting of the Royal Commission on the Constitution I questioned distinguished lawyers in every State of the Commonwealth, hut not one of them was able to give a single satisfactory reason why the Commonwealth should not have passed a uniform bankruptcy law leaving the administration entirely to the States, a process which would not have meant an increased cost to the community or to the unfortunate people engaged in bankruptcy litigation. There is a very common practice in other countries enjoying a federal or semifederal constitution, which might with advantage bo followed by Australia. In regard to a large number of matters it is considered tha.t absolute uniformity of legislation is necessary. The legislation is passed by the central authority and the administration is left entirely to the States. In regard to another large group of subjects iu respect of which a fundamental law is considered necessary, fundamental pieces of legislation are enacted by the central authority leaving to the States the enactment of the details to fit their own peculiar circumstances which must, of course, be in conformity with the fundamental principles laid down by the central authority. In that case the States carry out the whole of the administration. What was the position in Australia with regard to bankruptcy? Every State had its bankruptcy laws, and the chief defect was they were not uniform. Each State had its administrative machinery, and carried on at a small cost. Why could not the Commonwealth have remedied the defects that existed, provided uniformity, and still have left the administration to the States, at a comparatively small cost?

Senator McLachlan:

– That was dis- ‘ cussed in 1912.

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

– It was discussed many times, and no satisfactory reason was given why it should not be done. It was the insatiable lust for power and the desire for appointments that was responsible for the course taken. As a result new departments were built up and new offices created at enormously increased expense - an increase so great that in many instances the charges are now fourfold what they were under the old State system. I have it from every State in the Commonwealth that the inconvenience is great, and that the advantage that might have been derived through a uniform bankruptcy law has been dissipated by this increasing inconvenience, and entirely destroyed by the greatly increased cost.

The same argument is applicable to ;i great number of other activities. I do not believe that there is a single instance in which the Commonwealth has taken over administrative activities previously carried on by a State in which the cost has not been increased by 30 per cent. Every industry in the Commonwealth is at present sick to death, groaning under the excessive cost of government. No other single cause has so adversely affected our industries as the excessive cost of government. It is an enormously difficult matter to handle, and tremendously difficult to put down once you put it up. I have no hesitation in saying that that is, in some measure, due to bills like this, in which the Commonwealth Parliament might so easily have given Australia a uniform law and left the administrative details to the States. The policy of the Commonwealth has led to an enormous inflation of the Civil Service. I have nothing to say against civil servants. As one who held ministerial office for seven years, I know with what ardour and earnestness civil servants, as a rule, perform their tasks. But an inflated civil service is likely to threaten the stability of a country, and may very readily threaten it in the case of Australia.

Other matters of a similar nature will occupy the attention of the Government now, or in the future - for instance an endeavour to bring about uniformity in our marriage and divorce laws. I trust that, when that subject is considered, we shall have a government in power with sufficient judgment to ensure that it is possible to give Australia uniform marriage and divorce laws without taking the administration away from the States, creating new appointments, and piling up costs. I am prepared to see this measure go through. If any honorable senator is able to improve it, well and good. I hope that, when the Government is considering a comprehensive bill on the subject, it will again explore the possibility of giving Australia a uniform bankruptcy law, and allowing it to be administered in a most expeditious and inexpensive way by the States themselves.

Question resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time.

In committee:

Clauses 1 to 4 agreed to.

Senator MCLACHLAN:
South Australia

– I move -

That the following new clause be added: -

Section ninety-one of the principal act is amended by inserting in paragraph (e), after the word “registered”, first occurring, the words “ and kept registered “.

It was found under the New South Wales system that when registration had to be renewed the provisions of sub-section e of section 91 were not wide enough to cover that renewal. Section 91 relates to the property of a bankrupt divisible among his creditors, and stipulates what that property “shall not include”. The amending clause provides the protection desired.

Senator DALY (South AustraliaVicePresident of the Executive Council)

Senator McLachlan in this matter. The Government is prepared to accept the honorable senator’s amendment.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Senator McLACHLAN:
South Australia

.- I move-

That the following new clause be added: -

Section one hundred and fifty-eight of the principal act is amended by adding at the end thereot the following words: “ except by resolution passed, at any meeting of creditors duly convened, by a majority in number and value present thereat either in person or by proxy, and assented to by the debtor “.

That provision is necessary owing to the exclusive character of section 158 of the principal act, which provides that if a meeting of creditors is held in relation to the affairs of a debtor no proceedings in relation to his affairs shall be taken under part 12 of the act. Part 12 of the act is really the old common law method of assigning an estate. In New South Wales the provision was found to work adversely,’ both to the debtor and creditor. Usually the solicitor would call a meeting of creditors under part 11 of the act, whereas all parties might desire to take action under part 12. The amendment now allows that action to be taken by common consent. I commend it to the Senate.

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · ALP

– This provision was under consideration by the Government but was not embodied in the amending bill. As Senator McLachlan deems its inclusion advisable the Government is willing to accept it.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Senator MCLACHLAN:
South Australia

.- I move-

That the following new clause be added: -

After section one hundred and ninetyseven of the principal act, the following sec tion is inserted: - “ 197a. If the debtor has made a conveyance or assignment of his property under a deed of arrangement to a trustee for the benefit of his creditors generally, and the same has been registered in accordance with the provisions of this part, the trustee shall, in the event of a bankruptcy petition being presented against the debtor founded on the execution of the deed or on any other act committed by the debtor in the course or for the purpose of the proceedings preliminary to the execution of the deed as an act of bankruptcy, receive from the Registrar a notice of the hearing, and may appear and show cause for the dismissal of the petition, and if it appears to the court that it will be for the advantage of the creditors that the estate should be administered under the deed the petition may be dismissed.”.

There is urgent necessity for such a clause as this. “When a deed is executed under part 12 of the principal act it is not effective against any person who stands out, and any creditor having the necessary amount of debt can levy toll upon the estate by refusing to become a party to the deed or otherwise threaten to throw the person’s affairs into bankruptcy. This amendment will give the person an opportunity to be heard before bankruptcy is granted.

Senator Daly:

– On behalf of the Government I accept the amendment.

Proposed new clause agreed to.

Title agreed to.

Bill reported with amendments.

page 3847

WESTERN AUSTRALIAN AGREEMENT (WILUNA GOLD MINES) BILL

Second Reading

Debate resumed from 4th July (vide page 3698), on motion by Senator Daly -

That the bill be now read, a second time.

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE (Western Australia) [8.30]. - I propose to support the second reading of the bill. To obtain a proper perspective of the subject it is necessary to go back some years, to the time when the previous Government, acting on representations made by the Government of Western Australia, appointed a royal commission to investigate the disabilities from which that State was allegedly suffering as a result of federation.. That commission found that certain industries in Western Australia were suffering as a result of federation, one being the gold-mining industry. The report clearly set out the reason why that industry was singled out, and made a recommendation that the Commonwealth Government should grant an amount of money to the State of Western Australia in consequence of the disabilities suffered. The report was not unanimous as to amounts of compensation, but was unanimous as to the fact that the gold-mining industry had suffered as a result of federation. The first Commonwealth Government which dealt with that report made a special gran’t to Western Australia of £300,000. Subsequently, the grant was extended over a period of five years. However, I wish particularly to direct attention to the fact that one of the conditions attached’ to the special grant of £300,000 was that it was to be used by the State Government to assist those industries which, in the opinion of the commission, had suffered as the result of federation. Acting in accordance with the views expressed by the commission, the State Government set aside a definite portion of the grant for the assistance of the gold-mining industry.

It is interesting to note that the money was distributed among certain mines on the Golden Mile and the Sons of Gwalia Mine to the north of Kalgoorlie, the object being to assist those companies to extend their plants. In the case of the Sons of Gwalia Mine, the money was used to rehabilitate the plant, which was antiquated and not efficient. The company was enabled to put in a new plant, and, as a result, was able to show better results in working the ore bodies. I take it that this proposal is on somewhat the same lines, in that any claim made on the Commonwealth Government will be regarded as a grant, not to the mining companies in Western Australia, but to the State Government to compensate the State for the disabilities suffered by its industries as the result of federation. It is on this understanding that I support the bill.

I agree with the Vice-President of the Executive Council (Senator Daly) that this proposal contains a slight element of risk; but, having perused carefully the report which the honorable the Minister made available to me, I am convinced that the Wiluna Mining Company is a bona fide concern with excellent prospects. It has established its bona fides by the amount of capital which its shareholders have contributed, and by the way in which the directors have expended money on its development. The reports of experts who have examined the mine justify the claim that if additional capital is introduced the company will be able to extend its operations and show a good return on the expenditure. The Wiluna. Mining Company is not like a number of other ventures that have been floated simply on the strength of a prospectus, lt has a property which has been worked for a number of years, and lias demonstrated its value by the returns that have been received for the work done. Its value has been further established by a number of exhaustive tests carried out by competent experts. If honorable senators will take the trouble to peruse the report of Mr. Alexander Montgomery, the State Government Mining Engineer, they will agree that no more exhaustive examination could have been made to satisfy the State Government o rhat the mine is a genuine proposition.

I wish to refer briefly to one or two features in thu reports of mining experts who examined this property. In the first place, there is a statement by Mr. Wall, the consulting engineer of the Wiluna Gold Mining Company. Mr. Wall states that £1,000,000 capital has been subscribed and spent in the purchase, development, and equipment, of the mine. I understand that the greater part of this expenditure lias been on development and equipment, and that it is proposed to extend the plant so as to be in a position to treat 40,000 tons of ore per month. The company now requires an additional £550,000, but owing to the condition of ibc money market, it is not able to raise this amount. The company is, however, increasing its capital by £250,000, which it 13 obtaining from existing shareholders, and it is getting £300,000 from the Midland Bank. The State Government has agreed to guarantee this amount on the understanding that the Commonwealth Government will stand behind the guarantee. As evidence of its confidence in the value of this mine, the State Government has extended the railway to Wiluna. I f the mine proves a failure, that railway will be a white elephant, because the traffic on it would not pay for axle grease for the rolling-stock. Naturally the State Government, before committing itself to this expenditure, went to considerable trouble to be sure that the mining proposition was a sound one.

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE.No; it is part of the State railways system.

Senator Sir GEORGE PEARCE The directors of the company are satisfied that the mine can be made to pay. It has abundance of ore, which can be treated on a big scale at a profit. It may be of interest to note that the people who have contributed the greater part of the capital to this company also own mines on the Golden Mile and in South Africa. They are not members of the ordinary public, who speculate in mining propositions on the strength of brilliant prospectuses. On the contrary, they are men who have had long experience in mining, so we may rest assured that before they risk their capital, they seek the advice of competent experts to guide them. The main shaft is down 407 feet, and a number of other shafts have been sunk on the various lodes. In addition, the mine has been tested to a great depth by diamond drilling, which has demonstrated that the great body of ore and the values are fully maintained. It is also interesting to remember that this company will pioneer mining methods hitherto unknown in Australia, and it is confident that production costs will be reduced. I do not suggest that the methods to be employed have not been adopted in other countries, but ‘so far as my knowledge goes, they have not hitherto been tried in Australia.

The reports by the general manager, Mr. Prior, and Mr. Vail, also a consulting engineer, confirm the general opinion as to the value of the property.- Both of these experts agree as to the policy to be adopted. The main shaft, as I have stated, has been carried down to 407 feet, and crosscuts have been run out and worked down to provide for operations on a big scale. The present company, I should add, took over a mine which had been partially developed by another company some years ago, and the ore returns and other information concerning the operations of the mine are on record in the State Mines Department of Western Australia.

Probably the report by Mr. Montgomery, the State Government Mining Engineer, will be regarded as of more importance than the report of Mr. Wall, consulting engineer to the Wiluna Mining Company. Mr. Montgomery was : liked to say whether or not the State would be justified in constructing the railway to Wiluna. He is a man of wide experience, and is well trusted by the mining community and the people of Western Australia. His report is a very elaborate one. I hope honorable senators will read it. Ho checked the company’s estimates of values with a competent inspector of mines, and carried out his tests through the Wiluna State Battery ;ind the Government Minerologist and Analyst’s Department, so it was an absolutely independent examination of the company’s asset. He made 133 assays which gave an average value of 33s. per short ton. He also supplied full details is. to how those assays were made and i he values determined. In his report, he slates -

When the levels have been .extended throughout the whole length of the lodes known to be ore-bearing, there will probably l>u not less than 1,000,000 tons of ore above the levels on the west and east lodes at 200 foot and 200 feet, respectively, of somewhere a bout 40s. value per short ton.

– In Canada, it may be free milling ore, which is quite u different proposition from refractory ore, such as the sulphides of Wiluna. I do not want it to appear that I am opposing the bill merely for the sake of factious opposition. My opposition is due to the fact that I dread the Commonwealth entering into this new field which will” only lead to encouraging another body of men to approach the Federal Treasurer for assistance. There are gold-mines in Queensland and Tasmania; there are dozens of them all over the country, and the people who are working them would very readily come along and seek assistance from the Federal Government if they could get it. I cannot support the bill, because it is setting up a dangerous precedent and will mean that the Commonwealth is launching out upon an expenditure which should be a State responsibility. In view of the financial statement just presented, I cannot see that it is desirable that we should embark, at the present time, upon an expenditure of £300,000 on a purely speculative undertaking.

Senator McLACHLAN:
South Australia

– I should have been glad to support this bill, but I feel that its title is a misnomer. The history of the Wilu na transaction is summarized in a letter written by Mr. H. E. Vail, consulting engineer, and addressed to the Hon. P. Collier, when he was Premier of Western Australia. It is dated 16th January, 1930. As one honorable senator has already pointed out, the suggested grant to Western Australia is only a guise under which a guarantee is to be given for the purpose of supporting the bank overdraft of the Wiluna gold-mines. It is obvious from Mr. Vail’s letter that the approach was made, in the first place, to the Prime Minister (Mr. Scullin) and the ex-Treasurer of the Commonwealth (Mr. Theodore). Mr. Vail wrote -

The first instructions I received were that

I approach the Federal Government for an advance of a very substantial nature; alternatively to request the State Government to provide a bank guarantee of £300,000. On interviewing the Prime Minister (Mr. Scullin), and the Commonwealth Treasurer (Mr. Theodore), I was informed that it was absolutely impossible for the Government to comply with our request as they themselves were much in need of cash. It then occurred to me to request them to guarantee our bankers rather than to approach the State Government, realizing as I do that the State Government has at all times shown a disposition to assist mining as far as their resources would permit, and that in regard to Wiluna they have gone very far in providing a rail”way for our convenience. I therefore requested the Commonwealth Government to guarantee our bank for £300,000, and while they expressed their sympathy and desire to assist us, they pointed out the inadvisability of making such a grant to an individual company,

That is excellent logic and one pauses to ask, Why this change? but suggested that if your Government would make the guarantee which I desire they would guarantee your Government against loss.

What does that mean? I suppose that the Commonwealth Government felt that there was a difficulty under the Constitution. But let me go a little further back and see what Mr. Vail had in his mind when he sought a governmental advance. Presently, I shall refer to the paucity of information supplied to the Senate. Mr. Vail, in an earlier part of his letter to Mr. Collier, wrote -

The original capital of £1,000,000 provided for the purchase of development and equipment of the mines is now exhausted.

How much of the £1,000,000 really went into the mines does not emerge from any papers placed at my disposal. The report continues -

And according to the estimates provided by our general manager, we require a further £550,000 to complete our undertaking. My principals advise me that this sum is absolutely beyond their ability to raise. They have, however, intimated that if the Government will provide a bank guarantee for £300,000 it will not be beyond their ability to raise a further £250,000 of fresh capital’, in view of the confidence which will be inspired by the Government’s action in responding in this practical manner.

– There is no urgency for this bill, and there is ample time for an investigation to be made by Mr. Gepp or Mr. Gunn. It is unfortunate that the services of Dr. Woolnough, who is absent in America, are not at our disposal. Without some such inquiry I am not prepared to commit, this country to the expenditure of £300,000 merely on the strength of State, reports which I regard as insufficient and unsatisfactory.

Senator LAWSON:
Victoria

. Certain facts appear to me to emerge from this debate. The Senate should hesitate before it refuses to ratify this agreement. We are asked under this bill to ratify an agreement which has been made in “good faith by the Government of Western Australia on the promise of the

– I admit that Mr. Gepp is a highly qualified mining engineer in his own sphere. He is a man lor whom I have the highest regard, one who, in his own class of metalliferous science, has few peers in Australia or, indeed, in the world. But his actual experience has been confined to silver-lead fields, and particularly the smelting side of the industry. So far as I am aware he has never been associated with a goldmining concern in Australia. Mr. Gepp may have acquired a technical knowledge of the industry, but a practical knowledge is necessary before one is properly able to assess the value of a show. I remind Senator Glasgow of the experience of those in charge of the Rosebery mine in Tasmania. That is an old field that has been worked for more than 30 years. We have been told during the course of this debate that the Germans lead the world in metallurgical research. I remind honorable senators that the Rosebery mine was controlled by a German company, that sunk £250,000 in it. It is now being developed by an entirely new process largely the result of the investigation of a couple of Australians who paid particular regard to the peculiar problems nf the mine. They did not rely upon hook knowledge, but by practical experiment evolved a process at Rosebery and Zeehan that warranted their recommending a further expenditure of £200,000 on the field, which would be exploited by the new process.

Senator Herbert Hays:

– Mr. Gepp took an important part in that investigation.

Senator O’HALLORAN:

– Because it was a silver-lead show. That indicates that when seeking advice on a subject it is best to obtain it from people who have practical as well as technical experience. The officers of the Western Australian Department of Mines are eminently capable, practically and technically. Senator McLachlan insinuated that in agreeing to this guarantee the Commonwealth Government and the State Government of Western Australia are placing themselves in the position of a decoy to encourage the subscribing public to furnish the £200,000 additional share capital required. I refer Senator Sampson to Senator McLachlan’s statement, because he, by interjection, said that something ought to be done to open the Briseis tin mine in Tasmania, which was dismantled and almost ruined by the regrettable flood that occurred in that State some twelve months ago. I remind the honorable senator that the Tasmanian Government offered to guarantee the Briseis tin-mining company to the extent of £30,000 if the shareholders would provide a like sum for the purpose of re-opening that mine. I do not think that Senator Sampson would claim that in taking that action the Government of Tasmania placed themselves in the position of a decoy, to induce shareholders to subscribe.

I find it difficult to understand the attitude adopted by Senator McLachlan towards this measure, particularly in view of his recent eloquent advocacy in favour of- a gold bonus. The other night Senator McLachlan propounded to honorable senators a scheme whereby not only would our trade balance in his opinion he restored, but our external indebtedness metamorphosed to an internal indebtedness. We have a number of mining propositions which are at present in the non-productive stage, but which, we are assured, will begin production following the passage of this bill. I understand that, as the result of reliable tests, the Wiluna company estimates it will be able to treat monthly 40,000 tons of ore, with values ranging from 24s. to 40s. per ton. On this basis, the tonnage treated per annum will be about 480,000. At a low average value of 30s. per ton, which is less than the average estimated as the result of the investigations that have been made, this will return approximately £700,000 per annum, representing at present prices about 200,000 oz. The reports of the State mining experts indicate that there is sufficient Ore in the property to maintain this volume of production for 25 years, so we may take it that, during the period mentioned, the wealth production of Australia will be increased by from £16,000,000 to £18,000,000 as a result of the development of this mining proposition.

It has been said that Mr. Gepp and the other experts constituting the nuclei of the Development and Migration Commission, whose services are’ being retained by this Government, should be utilized to advise the Ministry on questions of this nature. I remind honorable senators that the Development and Migration Commission conducted an inquiry into the general question of assistance to the mining industry in Western Australia, and made recommendations somewhat on the lines followed in this bill.

Senator Reid:

– Did the commission make any recommendation with regard to the Wiluna company?

Senator O’HALLORAN:

– The Wiluna company was not treated separately. Neither was the Lake View and Star or the Sons of Gwalia, or, for that matter, any other mine in Western Australia. The Development and Migration Commission recommended that the mining industry in Western Australia was entitled to assistance, and that it should be in such a form as to enable certain proved shows to be developed, rather than a bounty on the production of gold from existing mines.

Senator Sampson:

– Did Mr. Gepp recommend this scheme?

Senator O’HALLORAN:

– Not in substance, but the recommendation of the Development and Migration Commission was practically on all fours with the proposal contained in this bill.

Since I have been a member of this chamber, I have listened to the representations made by other honorable senators concerning the assistance required for industries peculiar to their States. I take the view that the Commonwealth should pay particular attention to the needs of Western Australia, South Australia and Tasmania, which derive less benefit from federation than, do the more populous States, like New South Wales and Victoria. The Senate now has an opportunity to sanction a measure of assistance being given to Western Australia to assist its mining industry. That State is fully entitled to this financial aid. The fact that it is receiving financial assistance from the Commonwealth demonstrates beyond all doubt that the State Government is not in a position to stand alone in guaranteeing the Wiluna company in its proposal to develop its property. The reports of mining experts, which were quoted by the right honorable the Leader of the Opposition, indicate that there is no reason to fear that the expectations of the mining company will not

De realized. In that event the Commonwealth will not be called upon to find any portion of the sum guaranteed under this bill. The measure is really honoring an agreement made between this Government and the Government of Western Australia. That agreement, I suggest, demonstrates that this Government is not unmindful of the claims of the smaller States to assistance. In this matter we should take the broad Australian view, without regard to whether the assistance is being given to Western Australia, Queensland, Tasmania or any other State.

Senator REID:
Queensland

.- This afternoon the Leader of the Senate (Senator Daly) presented a financial statement, which, I venture to think, is not a good advertisement for Australia. Now, following closely upon that statement, we are asked to endorse the action of the Government in guaranteeing financial assistance to what Senator McLachlan has described as a new industry. In view of the unsatisfactory state of Commonwealth finances, the action of the Government in bringing forward this measure is, to say the least, highly injudicious. I have not the slightest objection to the Commonwealth granting financial aid to Western Australia upon proper lines. That State, as we know, has suffered under federation, and it is already receiving special grants from the Commonwealth. I refuse to vote for this measure on the ground merely that it endorses the action of the Government in making an agreement with the Government of Western Australia to stand behind a private mining company in a scheme to develop its property.

Senator Daly:

– Then the honorable senator does not believe in private enterprise?

Senator REID:

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

– If persons such as the Abrahams brothers, of whom we . once heard at interminable length, were to attempt to evade the strict terms of the law they would be denounced by the members of the present Government, and measures would be introduced to stop up the loop-holes which had been discovered. This proposal has been submitted in this way to avoid the strict letter of the Constitution. Notwithstanding this, Senator Lawson has told us that our hands are bound.

Senator Carroll:

– He said that we were morally bound.

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator COOPER:

– I admit that, but it does not alter my contention. Crops can be grown and re-grown on the same land and increased in volume year after year. They are a definite wealthproducing asset to the country. That is not the case with a mine. Reference has been made to the Mount Isa mine, which I know very well indeed.

Senator Dunn:

– The ore values of Mount Isa are all out of sight.

Senator COOPER:

– A scientific investigation was made into the value of Mount Isa just as was done at Wiluna. Thorough tests were made as to the value of the ore available before large and costly development work was undertaken. I t is said that there is sufficient mineral at Wiluna to keep the company going for 25 years. I remind honorable senators that it is also claimed that there is sufficient mineral at Mount Isa to last for 100 years. While a request was made for Federal aid for Wiluna, application was made to the Government of Queensland for assistance in the form of a guarantee for the Mount Isa mine when there was a shortage of funds in tlie case of that company. I believe that the State Government is the proper authority to approach in such matters. Although the price of minerals was low when the Mount Isa Mining Company required further capital, the Premier of that State (Mr. Moore) did not hesitate to guarantee the company on its own responsibility in the amount of £500,000 and I have no doubt that his action strongly influenced speculators in London to take up the bulk of the shares. Senator Johnston mentioned that the railway line, built by the State Government to Wiluna also opens up a considerable1 area of good pastoral country. That being so, it cannot be argued that the mine is bearing the whole cost of the’ railway. If it ‘ makes possible ‘the development of a fair area of pastoralcountry, the State will he in -the posses-‘ sion of a substantial asset to offset its expenditure on the railway. Similar action has been taken in Queensland in respect of several mining propositions.’ The State Government built the DuchessMount Isa railway entirely for the development of the Mount Isa mine. It appears to me, therefore, that all questions of guarantee in respect of mining proposals should be purely the responsibility of the State Government concerned. I should like to give further assistance to Western Australia, but it should be on legitimate lines. If we endorse this proposal, every low-grade mining proposition throughout the Commonwealth will be entitled to ask for similar assistance from the Federal Government. In view of the difficult state of the Commonwealth finances I must reluctantly vote against the bill.

Senator CARROLL:
Western Australia

– There is just one point which I wish to put before honorable senators. I hope it will influence the caustically judicial mind of Senator.

McLachlan. Not long ago a royal commission appointed by the Federal Government, and composed entirely of men from the eastern States, with whom we had no influence whatever, recommended as compensation for disabilities which Western Australia was suffering under federation, the payment by the Commonwealth of a grant of £450,000 a year to that State. As a result Western Australia received £300,000 a year. I suggest that if the Commonwealth be called upon to pay anything in respect of this agreement - this contingency appears to me to be extremely improbable - it should be regarded as some little compensation for the underpayment by the Commonwealth of the grant recommended by the royal commission to which I. have alluded.

Senator Sir JOHN NEWLANDS (South Australia) [11.4.] - To-night we had placed in our hands a financial document which must give all honorable senators good reason to ponder and think very carefully before voting in favour of this proposal. We have been told by the supporters of the bill that the Government of Western Australia has undertaken heavy financial responsibilities in the construction pf a railway line to Wiluna for the development of the Wiluna mining proposition. But building a railway is the first act of any government which desires to open up an approved mineral area. A railway is necessary to transport mining plant to the field, and ore to treatment works. as well as for the convenience of the people who engage in mining on the field in question. It cannot therefore* be argued that, in building the ‘railway to Wiluna, the Government of Western Australia did anything that might not reasonably have been expected of. it. The Wiluna railway, we are told, is 115 miles long. Practically every State government has undertaken similar work for the same purpose, so I do not regard this expenditure by the Government of Western Australia as a reason why we should support the bill. I f the Commonwealth Government wishes to assist the mining industry in this way it has ample opportunity at Broken Hill where, owing to the present low price of silver and lead, several mines are closing and between 3,000 and 4,000 men are being thrown out of work. In South Australia also there are several mining fields which could be assisted in this way. A number of mines urgently need to be unwatered, but this work is never likely to he undertaken unless those controlling the mines receive some form of Government assistance. In Central Australia too there is an important mining field known as the White Range. Prior to the construction of the railway to Alice Springs we were told that it was necessary to enable the White Range field to be developed. That railway has been built for some time now and, so far as I know, the White Range mining area has not been tapped yet. If the Commonwealth Government undertook to guarantee financial assistance I have no doubt that .some philanthropic men would seriously consider the development of that proposition also. I listened carefully while the Leader of the Opposition (Senator Pearce) was speaking in favour of this measure. His utterances reminded one of the prospectus of a mining engineer wishing to induce investors to try their fortunes in mining. I was forcibly reminded of my own experiences as a young man, when I used to read alluring prospectuses an,d would rush along, fearful lest the share list should bo closed, to invest the few pounds which I had in one or other of those mining enterprises. My money is still out, and I am hot likely to see it again. The reports quoted by Senator Pearce were similar to reports issued by every mining manager who desires to interest the investing public in his particular mine. I suggest, however, that the Commonwealth Government has no money to risk in fanciful expenditure of this ‘kind, and that it must stop forthwith. What would the people of Australia say, if, to-morrow morning, they read in the newspapers that, notwithstanding the difficult state of Commonwealth finances, the Senate had agreed to the Government’s proposal to stand behind the Government of Western Australia in its guarantee relating to thisWiluna mining proposal? We should think twice before we vote for this bill. Public money cannot be put into speculative enterprises of this kind. I intend to oppose the bill.

Senator HERBERT HAYS:
Tasmania

– This agreement cannot be altered by the Senate. It must be either accepted or rejected. No amendment can be made to it without reference to the parties responsible for the agreement. I realize fully the responsibility resting upon all those honorable senators who intend to vote against it, because the Government, through the Prime Minister, has entered into an arrangement with the Government of Western Australia to guarantee the amount advanced by the Midland Bank to the company. There was ample opportunity for the Government to bring this measure before the Senate much earlier in the session. Parliament met in February this year. The Government should have taken the earliest opportunity to inform members of both chambers that it was committed to this agreement, subject to its ratification by Parliament.I am convinced that, in any event, Parliament will be called upon to pay the money if the bill is passed. I know from our experience in Tasmania that the Government always has to foot the bill in connexion with all proposals to assist mining companies, and there is no reason to hope that Wiluna will be any exception to the- rule. Consequently, the Government of Western Australia will have to find the money, and, in pursuance of the agreement made by this Government, the Commonwealth Parliament will be asked to vote money to reimburse the State Government. On the question of principle I intend to vote against the bill.

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · ALP

– I do not propose to reply at length to the arguments advanced by those honorable senators who have spoken against the bill. The right honorable the Leader of the Opposition (Senator Pearce) effectively answered all objections to the measure. I should not have spoken but for the- suggestion made by Senator Plain that this proposal should be referred to mining experts. I take it that those honorable senators who intend to vote against the bill will do so, not because in their opinion sufficient information has not. been supplied, but for the reason advanced by them that the bill is wrong in principle. That being so, no good purpose would be served by postponing it and, therefore, I cannot accede to Senator Plain’s request.

Question - That the bill be now read a second time - put. The Senate divided.

AYES: 13

NOES: 12

Majority . . 1

AYES

NOES

Question so resolved in the affirmative.

Bill read a second time and reported from committee without amendment.

Report adopted.

Senate adjourned at 11.22 p.m.

Cite as: Australia, Senate, Debates, 9 July 1930, viewed 22 October 2017, <http://historichansard.net/senate/1930/19300709_senate_12_125/>.

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Senate 9 July 1930

QUESTION

TARIFF

Senator COOPER:QUEENSLAND

Senator DALY:Vice-President of the Executive Council · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ALP

AUSTRALIA HOUSE

TARIFF: RETALIATORY ACTION BY OTHER COUNTRIES

Formal Motion for Adjournment

The PRESIDENT (Senator the Hon W Kingsmill:WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator Daly:

Senator Hoare:

Senator Guthrie:

Senator Daly:

Senator Daly:

Senator Guthrie:

Senator Sir HAL COLEBATCH:

Senator Guthrie:

Senator Sir William Glasgow:

Senator DALY:South AustraliaVicePresident of the Executive Council · ALP

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DALY:

Senator E B Johnston:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir George Pearce:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir William Glasgow:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DALY:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DALY:

Senator Rae:

Senator GUTHRIE:Victoria

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator GUTHRIE:

Senator Rae:

Senator GUTHRIE:

Senator Rae:

Senator GUTHRIE:

Senator Daly:

Senator GUTHRIE:

The PRESIDENT (Senator the Hon W Kingsmill:

Senator GUTHRIE:

Senator Rae:

Senator GUTHRIE:

Senator CHAPMAN:South Australia

Senator Rae:

Senator CHAPMAN:

Height of Tariffs - Commercial Treaties

Senator CHAPMAN:

Senator DUNN:New South Wales

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DUNN:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DUNN:

Senator Sir Hal Colebatch:

Senator DUNN:

The PRESIDENT:

Senator Daly:

Senator Sir WILLIAM GLASGOW:

Senator Daly:

Senator Sir WILLIAM GLASGOW:

Senator Chapman:

Senator Chapman:

Senator RAE:

Senator Thompson:

Senator RAE:

Senator Herbert Hays:

Senator RAE:

Senator Herbert Hays:

Senator RAE:

Senator H E ELLIOTT:VICTORIA · NAT

Senator RAE:

Senator Herbert Hays:

Senator RAE:

Senator Herbert Hays:

Senate
9 July 1930

Senator COOPER:
QUEENSLAND

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · SOUTH AUSTRALIA · ALP

The PRESIDENT (Senator the Hon W Kingsmill:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator DALY:
South AustraliaVicePresident of the Executive Council · ALP

Senator GUTHRIE:
Victoria

Senator CHAPMAN:
South Australia

Senator DUNN:
New South Wales

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator CARROLL:
WESTERN AUSTRALIA

Senator E B JOHNSTON:
Western Australia.

Senator RAE:
NEW SOUTH WALES · ALP; LANG LAB from 1931

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator H E ELLIOTT:
VICTORIA · NAT

Senator THOMPSON:
Queensland

Senator HOARE:
South Australia

Senator DALY:
ALP

Senator DALY:
Vice-President of the Executive Council · South Australia · ALP